Red Hand of Doom 4.0

Templar3378 · Jun 7, 2008

So I was bouncing around on the wizards forum with this, and with the arrival a bit early of my 4.0 books, I've started to, slowly, convert RHOD to a 4th Edition adventure.

To keep things simple, I'll be referencing the book a LOT (that and to keep myself with in the whole copy right law thing)

So. Here it goes. AND a disclaimer, this is going to dicuss monsters and other aspects of the adventure that could be spoilers. Keep that in mind if you keep reading and are going to be playing in it.

Part 1 - The Witchwood
(pg. 15) Marauder Attack
(2nd Level Party, 5 members)
Encounter Level –4th Budget - 850XP

Creatures:
First Wave - Hobgoblin Regulars ---> 1st Level Minions (25xp per)
Hellhouds ---> Straight Conversion - Hellhound 2nd level (125xp per)
Zarr - Hobgobling Cleric ---> 3rd Level Hobgoblin Cleric (150xp)
Uth-Lar - Hobgoblin Bladebearer ---> 3rd level, Hobgoblin Commander (150xp)
Second Wave - Hobgoblin Regulars ---> 1st Level Minons (25xp per)

Experiance Total - 850xp

Notes - Use the same tactics as the book describes the encounter. Being that this is the only fight the PC's are likely to get in, a higher level shouldn't be a problem. The staggered nature of the monsters arriving should also help but dropping a couple of the minions from the 2nd wave would be an option if the PC's are having some real trouble.

Another Option is to drop the level one of the hellhounds from the encounter

Don't forget, for larger or smaller parties to make the appropriate adjustments. I've made the a note of what size the party is that I made these for.

Encounter Elements:
Hobgoblin Regulars – 1st Level Minions. - I would probably use the Hobgoblin Grunts on page 138 of the Monster Manual, dropped one level to get them to the appropriate difficulty. Add some shortbows and go from there.

Hellhounds – drop these to level 2.

Zarr, Hobgoblin Cleric - This is the one that I am kind of stuck on right now. You could go and use the Warcaster on Page 140, but if you do, you might want to consider either adding or swapping one of his powers for Incite Faith (Kobold Wyrmpriest) to give him the Clerical Feel he's supposed to have. If you don’t want to do that though, you could leave him as a rather nasty controller surprise for the pc’s.

Uth-lar - Bladebearer - This one takes a bit a conversion too, but not too much. I would say use the Hobgoblin Commander on page 140, and either a) swap that Spear of his for a sword of some kind: maybe a two-handed. That or go the route of Dualwielding, but personally I'm more for keeping the Two-Handed route this one. The Commander would need leveled down to 3rd as well.

keterys · Jun 7, 2008

I've been poking at my own conversion, but was going to make it lower level. All of those hobgoblins are level 3 in the MM, the young dragons are level 5-7, etc. The only one that really struck me as higher level was the hydra and the worgs. To be honest, I actually thought it was really odd that all goblins are 1-4 but worg is 9.

Anyhow, I figured I'd do lower level nothing else to give folks time to learn the game.

Oh, and for Zarr I'd consider just adding the "Cleric" template onto another hobgoblin.

Imperialus · Jun 7, 2008

I think that RHoD would make a good heroic tier adventure. It's designed for 6-12 in 3.X but I expect you could change that to 4-10 in 4E. Especially since it ends with the ability to start putzing around other planes and stuff like that which would make a really nice bridge into the Paragon tier.

Blackbrrd · Jun 8, 2008

I have DM'd the Red hand of Doom in 3.5, and I think it would work quite well if you start out at level 2. Remember that level 4 3.5 character function quite a bit like level 1 4e characters....

It would also give your players a nice easy start to 4e. If you start at higher levels there will be more powers/rules to learn.

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It will be interesting to see what ideas your players will have for destroying the bridge guarded by the dragon.

My players went the expensive way: 2xfly scroll, 2xinvisibility scroll, flying cleric and druid casting stone shape to make the bridge crumble. This might be a tad difficult to do in 4e.

Then the tried to run away from the dragon, which caught up with some players, so the cleric casts sound burst. The dragon rolls a 2 on its save and falls to the ground.
The players: "Its small!"
Me: "No, its medium"
The players "Its a tiny dragon"
Me: "mumbles"
The players: "we smack it while its down and kill it"
Me: "grumbles"

Oh, did I mention I made the black dragon a CR9 large dragon, since they were so unimpressed by medium sized dragons? Was it a bit overkill? Yes? Very much so? Did it have waaaay to much hp? Yes? Did I have to fudge it? Yes... Next time, don't mess with my medium sized dragon.
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keterys · Jun 8, 2008

Blanket disclaimer: Don't read this thread if this module can be spoilered for you. We're discussing the actual monsters and such

So, as a player I was _exceedingly_ disappointed in that first dragon and I'm quite glad it'll be Large when my group encounters it.

I'm starting my group at 3rd level, ending somewhere between 10th and 12th in theory. So, faster levelling pace than 3E, but it should work out.

I'm not sure if I'll just reduce the level of certain creatures, or do a trick like reducing level by 4 and upgrading to Elite (for example, for Hellhounds or Worgs). Leaves them same XP and I can un-Elite them later if it comes up again, but makes the attack and defense work out a bit more nicely.

Not sure what I'm doing for the Hydra, since the lowerst level Hydra is a level 12 solo... and kinda boring, frankly.

Templar3378 · Jun 8, 2008

That was actually a question I had posted else where, was what roughly, would the level adjustment for this become. stretching things to 30 from level 20 was a bit of a throw for me.

I'll repost/edit my post of the new level (sounds like level 2-3 would be good) and see how it looks

Thanks!

Blackbrrd · Jun 8, 2008

I would just replace the hydra with another monster. As somebody said, hydras aren't that interesting... I think they got more boring in 4e than they were before, as opposed to every other monster I have seen.

keterys · Jun 8, 2008

Hmm, could make it a black dragon and change the later black one to a white dragon (needless symmetry aside, it feels silly to have only 4 of the 5 types

- make it more like a purposeful ambush than a random encounter.

Hmmhmm. Or just like a horde of kruthik or some other 'cool' 4e critter.

Boarstorm · Jun 8, 2008

Blackbrrd said:
I would just replace the hydra with another monster. As somebody said, hydras aren't that interesting... I think they got more boring in 4e than they were before, as opposed to every other monster I have seen.

My only real problem with that is that the hydra is very emblematic of Tiamat. I'm more inclined to try to stat up a lower-level version of a hydra and try to give it some unique abilities to keep the "foreshadowing" aspect of the encounter.

Benimoto · Jun 9, 2008

I just started my own conversion before I found this thread. I'll be sure to post my work, once I get a few things figured out. Lemme use some spoiler tags, since I'm discussing specific monsters in the module.

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One of the main difficulties seems to be in adapting fights that have very few monsters in 3.5, yet don't seem worthy of a solo monster. The 4e DMG explicitly steers you away from using overleveled standard or elite monsters as a single-monster fight.

The examples in part 1, are obviously the hydra as mentioned. Old Wracklegnaw is another possible problem, though it's unlikely that the PCs will fight him. Vrath keep has two monsters ostensibly encountered on their own, namely the manticore and Wyrmlord Koth. The manticore might not be a problem. A level 10 elite skirmisher isn't too far out of the level range, and being elite means it takes up the full XP of a level 5 encounter. As long as it plays coy and doesn't devote itself to annihilating the PCs when they're busy with another fight, I don't see a hige problem. For Wrymlord Koth, I was either going to have him with up to 4 imps, or have him join one of the other fights.

The chimera at the end of part 1 might be a slight problem, but I figure it can be replaced by another suitable threat. For instance, if I want to integrate more dragonborn into the red hand forces (perhaps instead of the blackspawn), a dragonborn raiding force on griffon mounts might work well here.
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Again, thanks for all the great ideas and discussion, and I'll be sure to post whatever I come up with.