Sneak Attack + Critical Hit?

d12 · Jun 9, 2008

When you score a critical hit on a sneak attack do you get max damage on the sneak attack roll?

Lord Zardoz · Jun 9, 2008

I would have to double check, but my understanding is that a Rogue Sneak Attack + Critical hit will result in Max Weapon Dmg + 2d6.

However, upon review, that understanding appears to have been incorrect. See following posts, but the short answer is that rolling a 20 / crit is no different than hitting on an attack roll of 14 and having all your damage dice come up the maximum.

END COMMUNICATION

Otterscrubber · Jun 9, 2008

Lord Zardoz said:
I would have to double check, but my understanding is that a Rogue Sneak Attack + Critical hit will result in Max Weapon Dmg + 2d6.

END COMMUNICATION

I believe this is correct, all dice other than the weapon damage are rolled as normal. Kinda sucks for dagger wielders as its not much of a bump unless you have some power that is triggering off the crit.

dervish · Jun 9, 2008

Nothing points towards sneak attack not being maximized by a crit. In fact, I actually read (but can't seem to find again) a custserv answer about it and they confirmed that they only dice you ever roll on a crit are those dice that are labeled as extra damage on crits.

Maximillian · Jun 9, 2008

Pg. 278

"Rather than roll damage, determine the maximum damage you can roll with your attack. This is your critical damage."

In a 3e mentality, I want to say sneak attacks aren't maximized, but the text implies that it's the maximum for the "Attack" not the weapon. FWIW, the next paragraph specifically mentions that extra damage from high crit weapons and magical properties is not maximized. Sneak attack is not mentioned.

The entry for sneak attack makes no mention of critical hits on Pg. 117, and the index only lists two places for critical hits. The other location (pg 276) is far less specific, and doesn't mention extra damage at all.

I think it looks pretty clear that SA is maximized. (And the Warlock's curse and the Ranger's quarry, at that.)

Mezzer · Jun 9, 2008

Actually, when you score a crit, all damage dice that you don't get specifically because you got a crit is maximized. This has been stated by someone at wizards, can't remember the exact quote. So for example, a ranger critting his quarry with a greataxe (on a basic attack), would do 18+Str+1d12.

Scarface6174 · Jun 9, 2008

Maximillian is correct. Anything (high crit weapon, magic weapons, etc...) that add extra damage dice on a crit ONLY are not maximized. p.278 in the PHB.

A sneak attack, warlocks curse, and hunter's quarry add extra damage normally and ARE maxed.

Thattanguy · Jun 9, 2008

Seems to me only weapon damage is maxed and that precision based damage (high crit, SA, magic, etc) are added after. maxing SA damage realy breaks rogue damage output. then again, with the need to Combat Advantage and how hard it is to get a crit in this edition, it doesnt really bother me either way.

Surgoshan · Jun 9, 2008

"Rather than roll damage, determine the maximum damage you can roll with your attack."

Things like sneak attack and hunter's quarry are added to the attack, rather than being rolled for the attack, so shouldn't be maxed.

Another clue is in the sneak attack excerpt itself.

"You decide whether to apply the extra damage after making the damage roll." [bolding mine]
After you've maximized your critical damage, you then roll sneak attack damage.

Minigiant · Jun 9, 2008

Yeah that how I read it.

In fact my 6yr old cousin only uses his SA after a crit. And since he is a ranger main class, he just waits for one of the twin strikes to crit. And it always does.

Fighter cleaves. Ranger flanks and uses twin strike.
over and over.