4th Edition Bard

saric · Jun 24, 2008

StephenHawking said:
For inhibiting strike, what's is the duration? It seems odd to have it last forever.

I was unaware of an ability named inhibiting strike for the bard. However, inhibiting song does not state when it ends. It should read:

"Deal damage equal to your Charisma modifier,
target takes a penalty to attack rolls equal to your Intelligence modifier on its next attack."

Baumi said:
Wow, really well done!

Just two things:

First I would give the Bard the proficiency with Rapier, since it is no stronger than a longsword but fit's really well for the class.

And second there is a problem with the music Instrument-Implement since most instruments need two hands, which is very hard to use if you want to use a weapon. In 3.X you could just sing or crack some jokes and have your hands free without any handicaps in spellcasting, but this doesn't work in 4E any more. Any Idea how to bypass that?

Very true, bard's were proficient with rapiers as well. Added.

I implied earlier in the thread that bardic instruments work akin to a holy symbol, which just requires it to be worn or held (if desired). In addition, the instrument can range from a "musical" instrument to a book or whatever the bard deems as an instrument to inspire.

I'm going to be releasing a new pdf today with fixes and changes.

Deadstop · Jun 24, 2008

Saric, great job!

I notice, though, that your bard offers multiple powers that inflict the "restrained" condition. Now, I prefer "restrained" to "immobilized" in most cases myself, but there aren't many other powers that inflict it. Even grappling/grabbing doesn't any more. Just thought that might be a balance concern.

Likewise, your bard has many powers that grant a full additional second wind (healing surge plus brief defense boost) rather than just a surge. That too is unusual among the classes. Since healing surges are still expended, it's probably not a big deal, but I thought I should mention it.

Finally, your first two level 19 attack powers are really more utilities, it seems to me. I like them, but I'm not sure they're in the right place.

Just those few concerns, though. Otherwise, looks absolutely great!

Deadstop

Taralan · Jun 24, 2008

This is an excellent class. I hope Wizard of the coast is watching since you just raised the bar for their own bard.

My only comment is that the first two sets of utility powers (Level 2 and 6) feel very combat oriented to me. I would add/replace a few powers for pure out of combat utilities. Maybe powers that help with the trickster/charmer aspect of the bard, bonus to bluff, power to convince someone for a few seconds of something very improbable, that sorts of things.

BTW for some reasons I cant access the PDF either.

Ginnel · Jun 24, 2008

Chimera said:
I understand what you're saying, but I'm committed to being a Bard, because I'm the Leader/Social Skills/Knowledge guy. The Informational aspect of my character is a biggie. I was specifically asked to play a Bard by the GM to play that role in the party. I'm maxed out/Optimized for Diplomacy and have very high scores in the other social skills. Like I said earlier, my character IS a Loremaster/Storyteller/Orator/Leader.
.

If you want that go Charisma/int warlord, maybe even human and add on knowledge skills as feats, pick up Jack of all trades too (+2 to all untrained skills) and it would fit with saric's suggestion

keterys · Jun 24, 2008

Given the scale differences between 3e and 4e, a +3 attack that lasts all encounter, every encounter is just way too good... for one round, sure. Or make it stick at +1 and sustainable? Sure.

Anyhow, great seeing this!

Corwin · Jun 24, 2008

One big problem that jumped out at me is that it seems bards can use Dexterity to attack with a greataxe.

Not diggin' on that.

Their Dex-based attacks (especially the At-Wills) should be restricted to light blades and such (similar to rogues).

saric · Jun 24, 2008

Deadstop said:
I notice, though, that your bard offers multiple powers that inflict the "restrained" condition. Now, I prefer "restrained" to "immobilized" in most cases myself, but there aren't many other powers that inflict it. Even grappling/grabbing doesn't any more. Just thought that might be a balance concern.

Likewise, your bard has many powers that grant a full additional second wind (healing surge plus brief defense boost) rather than just a surge. That too is unusual among the classes. Since healing surges are still expended, it's probably not a big deal, but I thought I should mention it.

Finally, your first two level 19 attack powers are really more utilities, it seems to me. I like them, but I'm not sure they're in the right place.

Just those few concerns, though. Otherwise, looks absolutely great!

Deadstop

I like the restrained condition it feels very bardish to me. The music is so good, the monsters are somewhat distracted by the song.

Actually the reason I chose to make second wind was to sometimes make the healing be a little different from the other classes.

Considering weapon of the gods cleric attack 5 is along the same lines very much like a utillity power. It also is still is under attack so I placed them in that category as well. Apparently anything that seems to do damage apparently falls under that category.

Taralan said:
My only comment is that the first two sets of utility powers (Level 2 and 6) feel very combat oriented to me. I would add/replace a few powers for pure out of combat utilities. Maybe powers that help with the trickster/charmer aspect of the bard, bonus to bluff, power to convince someone for a few seconds of something very improbable, that sorts of things.

Inspire competence being a bardic music already does this and its a class feature if you choose it. Granted its a good idea, I'll see if I can fit it i when I run over the bard again.

Old Gumphrey · Jun 24, 2008

Chimera said:
Both classes come out next year in the PHB2

Just a quick de-rail: they're coming out with a Summoner base class?

saric · Jun 24, 2008

Corwin said:
One big problem that jumped out at me is that it seems bards can use Dexterity to attack with a greataxe.

Not diggin' on that.

Their Dex-based attacks (especially the At-Wills) should be restricted to light blades and such (similar to rogues).

That is a damn good observation. I just had an image of a bard using a greataxe as a makeshift lute/weapon.

Hmm, I'll get on it probably later tonight/tommorow. I'm really enjoying the suggestions you guys are throwing out there.

I guess I'll wait till later in the week to collect more feedback then release the new pdf.

Thanks again everyone, keep the ideas coming.

Badwe · Jun 24, 2008

Perhaps he is a heavy-metal bard and he is "shredding" on his "axe" ? I would gleefully take up such flavor of the bard

--edit--

Me too, but not with a Dex to hit. "I deftly swing this gigantic sharp metal into his face."

Ah yes, such is the price to pay for awesomeness.

4th Edition Bard

saric

First Post

Deadstop

Explorer

Taralan

Explorer

Ginnel

Explorer

keterys

First Post

Corwin

Explorer

saric

First Post

Old Gumphrey

First Post

saric

First Post

Badwe

First Post

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