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I see your point Atanatotatos, but that is the Shadar-Kai's role in my book and we already have an explaination for it. I am inclined to think that the Drow simple seek power wherever they may find it, perhaps the Drow's transformation was simply a result of so much magic alongside a seperate breeding population, etc.

I don't want to limit the Drow, but I would say that Formorians should be tied to the Far realms, as this fits well - for me at least.

I know what you mean, and I agree about Fomorians feeling more like aberrant than dark, but... Drows have darkvision, a bonus to steatlh, the cloud of darkness power. In the FRPG there's the dark pact warlock which is tied to their races, plus a whole bunch of options that more or less involve darkness and powers tied to it...
I mean, it's not like it's necessary, i just think that in perspective it may be more appropriate if we want meta- and IC to be coherent...

Hmm, I’m slightly inclined to agree with Ata here… Forces of shadow suit drow very well fluff-wise and seem to have been tailored so mechanics-wise. I suggested playing on demonic dealings since that seems to be more traditional for drow (hell, in Fiendish Codex 1 they even wrote up the Lolth-specific yochlol demon).

I think that when they already have Shadow and Abyss going for them, throwing Far Realm dabbling in with it makes drow seem less focused concept-wise. This is all just personal preference, of course, but I guess I’d suggest that if are drow are implemented in the setting with strong relations to otherworldly forces, it doesn’t become too many different sources to not muddy the proverbial waters. It’s no biggie, though - either of the three, two of them, or all alongside works for me too.

How about giving the Far Realm stuff to the Formorians more exclusivly, and saying that the Drow used that magic to twist the Formorians - perhaps having recieved the know how from some devil. Once their creations turned against them the Drow blamed the taint of the far realm which was uncontrollable and chaotic.

Now the Formorians wield this chaotic magic and create jabbering hordes of Farspwan which they use against their foes, etc.

The Eladrin Nobility had long been dabbling in shadow magic, and the Drow as their inheritors possess much of this smae power. However, those nobles who stayed with the Eladrin had still been touched by the shadow and it was their descendents who eventually fled persecution within the Imperium to become the Shadar-Kai.

Cheers for the feedback btw folks! I do agree that the Drow fit shadow better, and the Formorians make a go the Farspawn, it also gives them a tier of minions below the Cyclops which is useful.

That's a pretty awesome take, definitely like it!

A possible slight spin on this could be that the giants who became formorians weren't deformed when enslaved to the drow. Perhaps after they rebelled, they sought to consolidate their power in the underworlds of the Feywild by reaching into the depths of Far Realm manipulation, which twisted them into their current forms. That way, you have the tragedy of them being more responsible for their own fates.

In any case, I really like a tight focus on formorians with the Far Realm. It could be awesome to make a notorious figure among them a formorian star pact warlock NPC...

[sblock=First blush response about drow history]As originally conceived the Imperium has never been a disfunctional evil drow kingdom. It would be an interesting "secret history" but it potentially could have a big impact on a lot of things.

(Like ere13's adventure is supposed to touch upon the Imperium's early history; and of course all the Imperium characters would be effected)

Both the drow and the shadar-kai are from the same offshoot of the Eladrin; they were matriarchal goddess worshipers who were excessively punished for their beliefs by the patriarchy and eventually exiled.

In exile they fell into demon worship; the shadar-kai escaped by pledging themselves to hadeys and became a gift to his wife.


I kind of like the idea that the drow weren't always "evil people" but got that way through a combination of bad choices, bad luck and things (demons) who took advenatage of their misfortune.

In roleplaying terms I felt like it had more kick.... A drow who's good isn't just a "special aberration" they're reclaiming an older tradition. You have someplae to go besides standing Drizzit like, on the fringes emoting about how tortured and hopeless your beautiful near-immortal self is.[/sblock]

Still most people aren't really interested in mariarchy/patriarchy type stuff; and the idea of the "fall of the drow" having been the result of external social pressures instead of they're-naturally-chaotic-evil is a bit of a departure.

I haven't fully digested Halfords ideas as ideas yet. I typed the above mostly so I could identify my own existing biases.

Whatever people think is best (provided it doesn't throw ere13 off too badly) I think can be incorporated into the setting.

I tend to think that having the drow as a minor force within the Shifting Seas makes sense. It helps ammorialate their evil reputation enough to explain the Temple of Night and Day.

I think we have some far realm stuff floating around; I may still be in 3.x mode but I always felt like it was supposed to be the "rarest" of the rare. I see some of the worst mystery cults as tapping into it.

[d]--[/d]

What if the Old Gods were imprisioned in the far realm? Perhaps it was the only place that could contain Kronos?

I hadn't ironed out the details at all yet, so I'll absorb all of this and find ways to incorporate it. I've already got a few ideas that are bubbling up

Well I will give it a few more days so that everyone has an opportunity to respond and then I will post a proposal.

As for the secret nature of the Drow's former rule I am inclined to think that since it was a thousand years ago it would likely be considered shameful by the Eladrin. It might be known to a small large proportion of Eladrin, but very few humans.

As for good Drow, umm, please no - or at least I'd rather not cater to them overly. We need some nice evil races, good old fashioned slit your throat evil. Of course in this write up the Drow would only have been evil for 1,000 years individuals would be a harkening to their Eladrin past - removed by only a few generations.

I do not understand which goddess or godesses the Drow were worshipping, and I did not find anything about it in the fluff - though I have been know to miss things. And I cannot think of one who would well. But to be honest I was never a big Loth fan and would love to seperate the Drow from her, I am thus inclined to ditch the matriarchal aspect in favor of a ruthless survival of the fittest mentality.

Halford said:

I do not understand which goddess or godesses the Drow were worshipping, and I did not find anything about it in the fluff - though I have been know to miss things. And I cannot think of one who would well. But to be honest I was never a big Loth fan and would love to seperate the Drow from her, I am thus inclined to ditch the matriarchal aspect in favor of a ruthless survival of the fittest mentality.

Click to expand...

You could have the Drow worship Gaia.

In their religion, Gaia was abused by the titans and manipulated by the current batch of gods. They would see the earth-mother as corrupted and enslaved by all of the other species, so they have dedicated themselves to purging the world of those that worship the false gods--and eliminating all other life, save their own (the one, true race).

Makes them something along the lines of Nazi environmentalists. They believe their doing good, but they'll kill, maim, torture, etc. to do it.

Their whole thing about fighting amongst one another, weeding out the weak children, and so forth would be an aspect of their earth-mother worship. To whit, imitating the forces of natural selection to create a more powerful species.

And if they worship Gaia, it explains why they live under the earth: they want to get as close to the heart of their goddess as possible.

we KNOW that a lot of people will want to play drows. Do we really have to make them utterly evil or absolutely mad this time too?