Halford said:
True I did hope the Isle was larger and I was happy with the idea that if undefined its size could be nebulous as a part of the transitive Isles, maybe their are swathes of Isle that are occasionally part of the Feywild, etc.?
If this would satisfy you... it's already in the setting.
wiki said:
Two of the near lands, in particular, have a strong relationship with Daunton due to fey zones that linked them to Daunton's interior forests: The Isle of the Fey Court and the Savage Lands.
From the
main setting page.
wiki said:
A massive hinterland filled with warring savage humanoids some people say it is a thousand miles from end to end, others merely hundreds. Until the intervention of a great hero it was linked to Daunton by the same zones that connected to the Isle of the Fey Court aggressive bands of goblinoids used to travel through the feywild and launch savage raids on Daunton. A Years of Steel Rain is a popular play enjoying a resurgence about a particularly terrible decade when the zones were open almost constantly and Daunton was trapped in a state of siege. Argo the Black cut off the zones some years ago.
Travelers still shudder to see the massive coastline of the Savage Lands suddenly appearing out of the fog as they sail to and from Daunton; so much so that sailors have a term for it ("being savaged") reflecting both the damage their ships take trying to navigate it's vicious weather and rocky shoals as well the damage the crew endures when the tribal longboats streak out from shore to assail them.
As signs that the zones to the feywild on Dauton have begun to re-appear become more manifest Dauntonians have begun to lend more credence to the tales that Arga's ritual was only temporary and required replenishment, and that her student Esthanapiros was secretly maintaining it all those years.
From the
Near Lands
Halford said:
Anyway as to the size of Daunton, first off Graf I think you do need to calm down a little about these things, the only time I ever recall reading about Daunton's size was in a two post dialogue between you and The Goblin King.
It's also on the wiki, under
Daunton.
wiki said:
The island itself is a bit more than thirty miles long on the N/S axis, featuring a deeply forested interior and shear cliffs around all sides. The cliffs recede to sea level only at one point, the large double bay around which the city of Daunton is built.
It's not in bold, but I'm not sure how I feel about the statement that it's buried on "some old thread with goblin king".
You knew about it. Because you've repeatedly posted about it
here (in favor of a big central mainland) and
here (when you proposed TI be re-sized) and in each case I've responded to you.
It's was also specifically brought up and discussed and resolved (in the sense that everyone participating on the thread
seemed satisfied) on the
Transitive Isles Proposal Thread. (Easiest place to start is here when
Gary says he thinks it should be 1000 miles)
In fact, that thread addressed your primary complaint. Or at least the specific thing you've asked for.
Halford said:
We have valleys between mountains, vast swathes of untamed forest, a few isolated villages here and there, some monstrous tribes.... I just want enough room for several monstrous tribes without stretching credulity.
Gary and cov and I spent a a lot of effort dealing with this and resolved it as explained
(in exaustive detail) here.
(We ultimately did a lot of it over email but that "exhaustive detail" link covers the issues, the content of the changes and the final result).
We created a whole
new zone, we sprinkled
little tidbits throughout the wiki...
Could the wiki be better... absolutely... (it sucks, every time I look at it I feel pain) but it's not like this hasn't been talked about and addressed at length.
[d]--[/d]
Halford said:
My understanding of the setting was that it was supposed to be modular so that DMs were not restricted.
Since I always argued against the desire to have a central zone... I'm not sure how you got the impression it would support the creation of one.
I'm sorry if I gave you the impression that modular meant "every DM can contribute without limit in the manner that they wish". It's more about giving everyone, collectively the ability to contribute equally without one person, who happens to be first, or the most aggressive or possess some other arbitrary attribute, getting to "take up the best real estate" (so to speak).
I've tried to articulate it under
modularity on the wiki.
[d]--[/d]
Halford said:
I'm not trying to "define the setting", I just want enough room for <x y z> without stretching credulity. Since I have a group of Eladrin just moved in and I believe there have been at least two suggestions of other entities within the main Isle.
You say bug, I say feature.
You want to have a temporary camp of Eladrin. Great!
You want to have something big and permanent that changes the setting.... it's sudden appearance is
supposed to stretch credulity. At the very center of the setting, the spot that everyone shares, it's hard for one person to make big changes.
It helps judges by making it very clear what will and won't fit. You may not like inland empires, but what if I want one? Why can you have thousands of miles of warring tribes and villages but I can't have an empire?
Why's my idea "less good" than yours?
If there is a simple, easy to understand reason why you can't park something setting-changing on top of Daunton (i.e. it wouldn't fit) it's a lot easier than a judge having to say: 7 villages is fine... but 15 (or 25) is too many.
[d]--[/d]
Halford said:
I appreciate all you have done for the project Graf, but I don't think a simply question - albeit accompanied by a suggestion - deserved such a response. You catch more flies with honey. True you also kill more with an electric bug zapper, but that's, probably, besides the point.
I'm really not sure how to respond.
We've been going back and forth and back and forth for literally months on this. It was, probably, the most contentious issue of the debate. I'm sorry if you're surprised, but I don't think that my response is some kind of aberrance.
I do apologize for my tone. Which is often unproductive. I can't really justify it. It's a bad habit. If it's any consolation you are not alone in disliking it. I don't think it's appropriate (once I've cooled down) and I can assure you that the other judges have pointedly brought it up as well. It's one of my many failings. I do try to self monitor, but, especially when I feel that we've discussed and worked on an issue at tremendous effort I tend to react poorly when I feel someone esays "I don't like the end result, lets do the whole thing over again".
You've made tremendous contributions to the setting too. You made Daunton, the mayor, old vic, Allaria, the Hobgoblin Empire and lots of other stuff I've probably forgotten.
And you're running a great game and you've been a big contributor as a judge.
I'm glad to be gaming with you and having a great time.
But I want us (the community, which includes both you and me) to come to some sort of understanding this time. I'm tired of having it come up again every two or three weeks.
I've talked a lot. Why don't you suggest how you think we should proceed?
o
)
)
); my current understanding was that it's mostly mangroves and dense jungle populated with sparse tribes of gnomes and shifters with ruins of a lost civilization around the shadowrift in the interior.
