D&D Knight Optimization?

Skead · Nov 15, 2008

Hi all,

The group I am in has LOTS of damage dealing classes and now officially a healer as well. So I was hoping to be a meat shield that excels in doing just that. I was thinking a Knight class from the PHII(?) because they can force enemies to focus them.

My question in a nutshell is; Is the Knight class the best option for a grade A meat shield? (Don't care about damage output at all)

How do you optimize for avoidance / mitigation (if there is any) via feats / armor?

Just have access to core books and common extras (like PHII, Complete Warriors, etc)

Thank you

StreamOfTheSky · Nov 15, 2008

The thing is for meat sheilds, unless you have a means to literally force enemies to attack you and no one else, you NEED to be a threat damage-wise. Simply standing in the way isn't an option. If you're turtled in full plate and a tower shield (with its lovely -2 to attack penalty) and a barely upgraded weapon with no feats to improve your use of it... enemies will wise up, take the not-so-painful AoO and run right past you.

Knight gets some class features to force enemies to attack you. Namely, a challenge ability with long range (test of mettle, I think), and bulwark of defense, which with a reach weapon (and maybe enlarge person so you threaten out to 20 ft away from you) can make it impossible to get past you. Be sure to get armor spikes or something so you still can threaten adjacent to you if going this route. All in all, Knight is pretty good for this and probably the best of the non-casting classes at it if you can't use Tome of Battle. If you can, search for the "lockdown Crusader" on wotc's character optimization boards to see what it can do.

As far as reach weapons, you already get some mounted abilities, so using a lance and some kind of mount might be a good plan. In all seriousness, Halfling Outrider is an awesome prestige class, maybe do knight x / druid 1 / HO 10, dipping druid for an animal companion mount (which increases in level from HO). Another option could be the Wild Cohort feat to get a weak animal companion. Sure, it might die, but you can get a new one in a day, which is useful.

Another option is spending an exotic weapon feat for the kusari-gama from the DMG (asian weapons section). I don't think there are any more one-handed reach weapons out there, and if you're tanking, you want a shield. There's Improved Buckler Defense, but I'd personally rather grab a heavy shield with Shield Specialization and Shield Ward.

Anyway, you ake no mention of casters for the party beyond the healer. Not all arcanists are blasters. You could play a wizard or sorcerer focused on buffing allies or debuffing enemies, as well as doing some battlefield control.

R1C0F3TT · Nov 15, 2008

The knight is infact from PH2.

Armor Specialization and Sheld Specialisation feats from PH2.

You should probably get proficient with tower shields. Wear full plate armor (obviously) and tower shield if you're proficient (maybe even if your not proficient, you don't care about damage output right?), and make them out of adamantine if you can afford it. Also get the best amulet of health you can afford (NOTE: it's cheaper to get a +4 amulet of health and a ion stone for +2 con, to get a +6 bonus than a +6 amulet of health). Of course this equipement is based on being around level 10-ish, so a lot of it is speculation.

StreamOfTheSky · Nov 15, 2008

As for feats, I really like the idea of PH2's Cometary Collision to protect the party from charging enemies. Lets you ready to counter-charge (not normally possible), interrupting the enemy's and keeping him from reaching his destination (he can chage targets to you). An example of a cool combofor this would be adding Hold the Line to the mix. Now, you interrupt his charge and charge him. He chooses to change targets to you, you get an AoO for being charged. Possibly two AoO's, if you also had reach on him. Obviously having Combat Refelxes helps.

Another great feat, and if you have reach over the foe is worth adding into the above combo, is Stand Still. Psionic Feats :: d20srd.org If you added to the above combo and had superior reach, the enemy would completely lose his turn!

If you can use Magic Item Compendium, the Steadfast Boots are dirt cheap and let you set vs. charge with any weapon for x2 damage. Cometary Collsion is setting vs. a charge....

The ultimate piece to this is unfortunately unavailable to you, due to alignment and (likely) books allowed. In C.Champion, Lion totem Barbarian variant gets pounce at level 1 (!!!!), which you could then combine with cometary collsion and the steadfast boots...

Just soem ideas, these kind of go more with my preferred meat sheild type: "the best defense is a good offense."

Dragonwriter · Nov 17, 2008

R1C0F3TT said:
(NOTE: it's cheaper to get a +4 amulet of health and a ion stone for +2 con, to get a +6 bonus than a +6 amulet of health).

This doesn't work. They both give an enhancement bonus, and those don't stack.

The Knight is probably the best choice for a definite meat shield. You can force enemies to target you, which actually lets you do your job. Pump your Charisma to make the challenges harder to resist. Shield Spec. and Shield Ward with a heavy shield (Then again, Buckler with Improved Buckler Defense and Shield Spec. allows you to have a -1 to attack, but still get to use a 2-handed weapon or two weapons...) are probably your best choice, along with getting Armor Specialization at 12th level.

Shin Okada · Nov 18, 2008

I have only used Knight class as an NPC. More specifically, a monster with PC class levels.

Bulwark of defense annoyed our PCs much. Especially with natural reach and/or reach weapon, it will prevent spellcasters from escaping easily.

And I found Armor Mastery could be interesting as it enables a Knight to ignore speed reduction for wearing armor. That means, a Knight can learn Tumble (likely as a cross-class skill) and use it when wearing armor. Mithral Full-plate with Nimbleness ability (MIC) has only -2 Armor check penalty.

pawsplay · Nov 25, 2008

Knight, plus Tactical Soldier and Knight of the Order. Take Daunting Presence and Powerful Charge. Now acquire reach, either through enlarging or by using a pole or chain.

Now you are shaking your opponents while buffing allies, occupying a big space on the combat grid, and if anything comes near you, you are locking it down. Once that happens, you can put your improved flanking to work. If anything escapes, you charge it.