Wrath of the River King - Wolfgang Baur's Open Design

Amphimir Míriel · Dec 27, 2008

Thanks to Munstrum Ridcully and others for their comments. What I believe is a bad strategy is not selling the product after its finished. For example, a better (IMHO) ransom scheme would be:

Option 1: Pay $100 before the project starts, and get full access, voice and vote on the developing adventure. Get your name into the credits. Get the adventure PDF once it ends.

Option 2: Pay $30 before the project starts, and get full access, voice (but not vote) on the developing adventure. Get the adventure PDF once it ends.

Option 3: Pay $30 after the project ends. Get the adventure PDF

This way, both options 1 and 2 get something more than just the finished product. They become part of the development process and can learn more of how a master DM creates an adventure. The rest of us get a good module on pdf, but nothing else.

And finally, I formally apologize if I came across as rude and insulting. That was not my intention.

Waylander the Slayer · Dec 27, 2008

The adventures are awesome, and indeed, works of art, and truly patron worthy. Having been a patron for the first 4 projects, it has been an enlightening, engaging and awesome experience. The two adventures I have run and have been running (Shadowcrag, segwaying to the kingdom of ghouls) have gotten nothing but rave reviews all around.

There are very few, if any patrons, that would agree to the notion of selling the product after it is finished on the open market. Ultimately, one of the incentives for being a patron is the scarcity of the product, electronic or not (unless people are ranting about doing illegal things). There are plenty of PDF adventures out there for those that find the Patron model to be nonsensical that are much cheaper as well.

Waylander the Slayer · Dec 27, 2008

Amphimir Míriel said:
And finally, I formally apologize if I came across as rude and insulting. That was not my intention.

Yes you did. What was your intention then?

Monkey King · Dec 27, 2008

It's sort of an anti-marketing strategy. I'm not interested in a mass audience for these projects, as they're meant to be smaller and more experimental work than I do for the larger publishers. They're financially self-sustaining but not meant to meet a company payroll.

And yes, current patrons get the current project, and can still pick up the prior project if it interests them.

EDITED TO ADD: I have no idea why patron projects make some folks lose their cool. They're very similar to limited editions or to subscription partworks, which are pretty well-known approaches to publishing.

The patron approach is definitely not for everyone. If you hate it, there's lots of other adventures to play.

Rechan · Dec 27, 2008

Thanks, Wolfgang. The open project details can be a little confusing.

Starglim · Dec 28, 2008

Waylander the Slayer said:
There are very few, if any patrons, that would agree to the notion of selling the product after it is finished on the open market.

I started in ransom projects with Dennis Detwiller, who releases the finished product publically for free. Selling it isn't the same thing, though. With some thought, I tend to agree it might taint the personal and experimental qualities of the design.

Waylander the Slayer said:
Ultimately, one of the incentives for being a patron is the scarcity of the product

Some might find it so. I don't see much admirable or genuine about this artificial sort of value, especially in a medium to which limited reproduction is unnecessary and unnatural. edit: It has some practical value, in that prospective players are unlikely to own the adventure.

Waylander the Slayer said:
There are plenty of PDF adventures out there for those that find the Patron model to be nonsensical that are much cheaper as well.

This, I'll entirely agree with. If you think it's a scam, don't buy it. If you're right, the scheme will collapse soon enough.

Amphimir Míriel · Dec 28, 2008

Waylander the Slayer said:
Yes you did. What was your intention then?

My intention was to discuss the subject, of course. This is a discussion forum, where people have strong opinions about gaming subjects.

Of course, that is no excuse for being rude, so once I realized my choice of words had been very poor, I came back I apologized.

Best of luck to Wolfgang and his project. We need new ways of making RPGs profitable to creators.

...the patron model, is however not for me at this point in time.

Monkey King · Dec 28, 2008

Starglim said:
If you think it's a scam, don't buy it. If you're right, the scheme will collapse soon enough.

Two years and three ENnie nominations later, I don't think that Open Design is collapsing anytime soon.

Jack99 · Dec 28, 2008

Monkey King said:
Two years and three ENnie nominations later, I don't think that Open Design is collapsing anytime soon.

Precisely! Please make sure to advertise (as you usually do) next time you do a 4e project. I am a big fan of your work, but haven't had the time to participate in one of your OD projects yet, and I plan to do it next time you do something 4e.

Cheers

RichGreen · Jan 3, 2009

Hi,

The new project has been announced here.

Patrons of Halls of the Mountain King will be able to purchase Wrath of the River King.

Cheers

Richard

Wrath of the River King - Wolfgang Baur's Open Design

Amphimir Míriel

Explorer

Waylander the Slayer

Explorer

Waylander the Slayer

Explorer

Monkey King

Explorer

Rechan

Adventurer

Starglim

Explorer

Amphimir Míriel

Explorer

Monkey King

Explorer

Jack99

Adventurer

RichGreen

Adventurer

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