New At-Will Power for Wizards - Staff Strike

Falling Icicle · Jan 17, 2009

Staff Strike - Wizard Attack 1
You strike with your staff and a surge of magical force drives your foe back.
At-Will * Arcane, Force, Weapon
Standard Action - Melee weapon
Requirement: You must be wielding a Staff
Target: One creature
Attack: Intelligence vs. Reflex
Hit: 1[W] + Intelligence modifier force damage, and you push the target a number of squares equal to your Wisdom modifier (minimum 1).
Increase damage to 2[W] + Intelligence modifier at 21st level.
Special: This power counts as a melee basic attack. When a power allows you to make a melee basic attack, you can use this power. This power can also be used as an opportunity attack.

Paul Strack · Jan 17, 2009

Interesting ... but why would you pick this over Thunderwave, which does almost as much damage, uses your implement and affects several nearby creatures rather than one?

Falling Icicle · Jan 17, 2009

Paul Strack said:
Interesting ... but why would you pick this over Thunderwave, which does almost as much damage, uses your implement and affects several nearby creatures rather than one?

The main advantage to this is it counts as a melee basic attack, so you can use it for opportunity attacks. Also, you can use your implement with it. Staves count as both implements and weapons, and magic staves add their enhancement bonus to both melee attacks and spells.

caul · Jan 17, 2009

I like it. I'm not versed enough yet to know if it is balanced, but I like the idea and the imagery it provokes, and that is important, at least to me. Would also make a great attack for NPC mages...

Cadfan · Jan 17, 2009

He also made it a Weapon power, giving it a +2 to the attack roll in comparison to Thunderwave.

CapnZapp · Jan 17, 2009

Yep, not good. (Especially as it doesn't target AC)

While I understand the frustration spellcasters feel when they don't get proficiency bonuses, just adding powers that do give them is the wrong way to go.

I don't have to add that sneaking them in (in this case, it took four posters before this bonus was discovered) is even worse.

Paul Strack · Jan 17, 2009

Falling Icicle said:
The main advantage to this is it counts as a melee basic attack, so you can use it for opportunity attacks. Also, you can use your implement with it. Staves count as both implements and weapons, and magic staves add their enhancement bonus to both melee attacks and spells.

That's a good point. I still wouldn't take it if I were playing a wizard, but I can imagine someone would. It doesn't seem unbalanced to me, even with the weapon proficiency bonus added in.

Falling Icicle · Jan 18, 2009

CapnZapp said:
Yep, not good. (Especially as it doesn't target AC)

While I understand the frustration spellcasters feel when they don't get proficiency bonuses, just adding powers that do give them is the wrong way to go.

I don't have to add that sneaking them in (in this case, it took four posters before this bonus was discovered) is even worse.

There was no "sneaking" involved. I didn't even realise that there would be a proficiency bonus until it was pointed out by the previous poster.

That said, I'd be interested to hear people's opinions as to whether or not the proficiency bonus should remain or the spell should be changed to have the implement keyword instead. From the tone of your post, I'd definitely assume you would be against it. I'm curious to know why. There are other powers that give +2 attack bonuses, do you think that this power would be unbalanced with such a bonus, and if so, why?

CapnZapp · Jan 18, 2009

Good question.

First off, even WotC have acknowledged the wizard class needs work. But whether this is the direction to go I'm not sure.

Generally, the objection is proficiency bonuses is not for spellcasters. Otherwise put, you generally don't get to use magical power and proficiency bonuses at the same time. Perhaps the staff could be put to better use in a way more in line with the designers' intentions?

That said, my specific reply to your question is "it's an at-will". If you make it Encounter, I wouldn't have anything against it. As an at-will, it would bring in proficiency bonuses into the core of the class, which simply doesn't seem to be what the wizard is supposed to be about.

The power itself is probably okay, as other postrs have remarked. For another class, that is. As a "fighting wizard"'s power it's probably okay. (I know nothing of any 4E spellblade-ish classes under development though)

Edit: I guess if it's in line with pact blades, it's okay too. But still, that you only get if the DM gives it to you. An at-will is a huge step above and beyond this, if you think about it. It redefines the entire class.

ravenheart · Jan 18, 2009

Well, if you compare it to other at-will powers with a +2 bonus (like the infamous Sure Strike), how about you drop the extra Int modifier damage? Like this:

Hit: 1[W] force damage, and you push the target a number of squares equal to your Wisdom modifier (minimum 1).

Alternatively, if you change it to the implement keyword, you could drop the [W] all together and just deal Int modifier damage.

Hit: Intelligence modifier force damage, and you push the target a number of squares equal to your Wisdom modifier (minimum 1).

But then wielding a staff stops making sense as a requirement, doesn't it? Why not just call it Force Push at that point?

New At-Will Power for Wizards - Staff Strike

Falling Icicle

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Paul Strack

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Falling Icicle

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caul

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Cadfan

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CapnZapp

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Paul Strack

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Falling Icicle

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CapnZapp

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ravenheart

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