Technique Feats, Style Feats, Arena Feats, oh my

Tellerve · Mar 25, 2009

So with the excerpt from Martial Power 2 I think they may have closed a door on something that seemed to get too good, but want to be sure.

Was there anything before this MP2 excerpt that said that multiple style augmentations don't work together? I noticed it there saying if you had multiple you had to decide which you were using at each of the At-will. That's how everyone else is reading it right?

Oompa · Mar 25, 2009

multiply style augmentation?

Really have to clarify this for me..

Skallgrim · Mar 25, 2009

Tellerve said:
So with the excerpt from Martial Power 2 I think they may have closed a door on something that seemed to get too good, but want to be sure.

Was there anything before this MP2 excerpt that said that multiple style augmentations don't work together? I noticed it there saying if you had multiple you had to decide which you were using at each of the At-will. That's how everyone else is reading it right?

I really don't see how these were too good. Not that I have a problem with the new implementation, but I didn't see any serious issues with "stacking" styles before.

The older Style feats only gave you a benefit on one At Will. This is a pretty minor benefit for the cost of an entire Feat. I suppose through multiclassing or half-elvenness, or a paragon path or epic destiny, you might have gotten the benefit from 2 At wills with one Feat, but it was still a pretty hefty cost.

I really think that the older techniques were bordering on being Trap Feats, that were actually less useful than almost anything else you could take, but they were flavorful enough that I can see people taking them, and, I suppose, if you really used one At-Will a lot, it might be pretty useful.

However, most people seem to try to use their encounter powers, and maybe a daily or two, in the fights. The At-Wills seem relegated to the rounds where you can't profitably use a "better" power.

On the other hand, it does thematically make sense to me that you can't "mix styles" like this. It would be kind of weird to say "I'm using my Graceful Butterfly stance and my Ravening Warthog attack."

Tellerve · Mar 25, 2009

Well, I was specifically looking at making a rogue build that utilized the Riposte strike often.

With that at-will, use

Vigilante Justice Style from Art of the Kill, Dragon 373. The attacked creature doesn't have to attack you to create the interrupt attack, just someone adjacent to you. So, you flank a guy and then attack with it, and as a move action, shift so that you are now adjacent to your flanker.

With Cruel Cut and Impending Doom style from the same, if you hit with the interrupt attack the target takes Wisdom mod ongoing damage (save ends) and -2 to attacks until the end of your next turn.

With Grudge Style and Warborn Fury style of arena feats from We who are about to die, dragon 368, you get with a successful attack with the interrupt attack a -3 to hit to the triggering attack, and -2 to AC and Reflex of the target's defense until the end of your turn.

So you use this, shift, and if the target attacks you or your buddy you attack him with the interrupt. IF the interrupt attack hits, the triggering attack of the enemy is at -5 to hit, the rest of his attacks until the end of your next turn are at -2, he's at -2 to AC and Reflex until the end of your turn, takes ongoing damage equal to your Wisdom (save ends).

So, yeah, in all fairness it is 5 feats to really beef the heck outta one at-will, but it does make that at will pretty nice. I don't think broken considering the amount of feats invested. But I like it nonetheless, and was wondering what others thought.

Mad Hamish · Mar 27, 2009

Skallgrim said:
However, most people seem to try to use their encounter powers, and maybe a daily or two, in the fights. The At-Wills seem relegated to the rounds where you can't profitably use a "better" power.

Depends a lot on the at wills.
Twin Strike or Righteous Brand each get a lot of use...

Danceofmasks · Mar 27, 2009

Also, you can use encounters and dailies at the same time as at-wills.
Rangers are good for that ... lots of attacking with minor actions and interrupts.

Doctor Proctor · Mar 27, 2009

Where is this excerpt? I checked the D&D site's excerpt archive, but the only new stuff I saw was the stuff from Arcane Power. Is this one DDI only? Or at least DDI early?

Tellerve · Mar 27, 2009

Doctor Proctor said:
Where is this excerpt? I checked the D&D site's excerpt archive, but the only new stuff I saw was the stuff from Arcane Power. Is this one DDI only? Or at least DDI early?

Hmm, yeah, maybe it is DDI, as I do have that subscription. It is from Dragon 373, and the article came out on the 23rd. The others, Art of the Kill and Gladiators came out earlier.

Doctor Proctor · Mar 27, 2009

Tellerve said:
Hmm, yeah, maybe it is DDI, as I do have that subscription. It is from Dragon 373, and the article came out on the 23rd. The others, Art of the Kill and Gladiators came out earlier.

Oh, no, I know where all the feats he's talking about came from. I've seen some of the Gladiator stuff before. I was specifically talking about the Martial Power 2 excerpt, because usually they put all of the excerpts and previews in the products section of the D&D main page and you don't need DDI access to see them.

So from your post am I to understand that the excerpt itself was actually in a Dragon article this time, instead of being posted on the main page? If so, that kind of sucks. I rather liked still being able to see what was coming in the books even if you weren't a subscriber, because I find the books to be a better "value" than the DDI subscription.

Shadowsmith · Mar 27, 2009

Martial Power 2 is being released next year. This is a playtest release, not a preview. They want player feedback on these feats so they can correct any issues with them before the mechanics are set.