Ryan Dancey - D&D in a Death Spiral

Derren · Apr 9, 2009

C_M2008 said:
My take exactly. Someone posting anti-WoTC sentiments that has everything to gain from doing so. Meaningless drivel.

4e seems to be doing pretty well from were I'm sitting. I won't bother posting my ancedotal evidence, since obviously that's not solid evidence just like what Mr. Dancey wrote isn't.

Still, there is some truth to his words. Its not normal that the PHB2 is sold out. It means that the demand of it is either really huge or really small. No room for a middle ground.

I also think its strange that in light of not being able to produce enough physical books WotC decides to stop the sale of PDFs which can fill this gap.

Aus_Snow · Apr 9, 2009

If it's true that he has been saying that 'the MMORPG star killed the tabletop star', basically, I would be more than a little wary of his commentary on RPGs of any kind since the time he started saying so, especially given his current place of employment and position there.

Damn.

I thought better of the guy, not knowing such things 'til now. He still did some great things, some time ago now, but yeah. . . damn. [edit --- this second bit is referring to that GAMA move - yeesh.]

Ourph · Apr 9, 2009

Derren said:
Still, there is some truth to his words. Its not normal that the PHB2 is sold out. It means that the demand of it is either really huge or really small. No room for a middle ground.

Is it really surprising that the PHB2 would be very popular? People have been talking excitedly about the PHB2 since the core books came out last summer. It contains three core classes (the Barbarian, Bard and Druid) which have been the most talked about "missing" classes in 4e. Plus, it's the only major release for 4e right now. It makes perfect sense to me that it's selling really well.

Mark Hope · Apr 9, 2009

frankthedm said:
A Book that is not tied to a ruleset. I.C.E.'s Nightmares of mine is a fine example of such.

I thought that "evergreen" was a book that sold consistently throughout the lifespan of a game's edition, like the PHB. Supplements have a limited shelf-run, but the PHB is always in stock and always sold. Guess I could be wrong on that, though. Wouldn't be the first time

Derren · Apr 9, 2009

Ourph said:
Is it really surprising that the PHB2 would be very popular? People have been talking excitedly about the PHB2 since the core books came out last summer. It contains three core classes (the Barbarian, Bard and Druid) which have been the most talked about "missing" classes in 4e. Plus, it's the only major release for 4e right now. It makes perfect sense to me that it's selling really well.

People have been talking excitedly about nearly all books.
The other theory is that a lot of gamers tried the core books and found out that 4E was not for them or that the core books are enough and don't buy the PHB2. Or at least that WotC and the retailers thought that this would happen.
Without having actual sales numbers we can't say.

guivre · Apr 9, 2009

C_M2008 said:
My take exactly. Someone posting anti-WoTC sentiments that has everything to gain from doing so. Meaningless drivel.

Interesting, so one can assume that you will discount any pro-wotc information from WotC employees since by your logic that would also be meaningless drivel.

PrecociousApprentice · Apr 9, 2009

Seems like, in light of the fact the the PHB2 was on the WSJ bestseller list, maybe WotC might have a good reason to not guess the demand accurately. PHB2 was a really big seller, bigger than previous books. It was obviously more anticipated than they realized. Why does there have to be ulterior motives or a doomsday prophecy to explain that it did better than predicted? It did realy well. Whoops, they underestimated that it would do this well.

Nice pot-shot Ryan, but your biases are obviously getting in the way. Sad.

EDIT: Sorry Derren, your analysis is a bit off. The PHB2 sold out, and it sold huge numbers. If it had just sold out, but not huge numbers, maybe you would have a leg to stand on.

filthgrinder · Apr 9, 2009

Kask said:
This is interesting. I have 3 each of BN & Borders in my area. All carried 3.x for the entire history of those versions. All carried the release of 4.0. NONE of them restocked 4.0 and don't carry it anymore. I asked the mgrs of the stores and they said it was because of lackluster sales compared to 3.x...

So, just to be completely clear here. A book store ordered stock on a book which sold out. The book is on best seller lists. The book store decides not to order anymore...

I guess this is why Borders is teetering on the edge of bankruptcy. You've basically said, "The new Harry Potter book came out, and it sold out and it's on best seller lists, but we aren't going to order anymore of it because the first Harry Potter book sold more".

The majority of bookstore managers who determine stock levels will look at what books sold in there store, what books sold in nationwide trends (best seller lists) and will stock those.

Anyways, Ryan's view is obviously colored by his personal and professional situation. We know te 4E books have hit best seller lists and sold out their print runs. People are really intent on coloring that as a failure.

coyote6 · Apr 9, 2009

Charwoman Gene said:
So the Chief Marketing Officer for the #2 RPG Company, which is also an MMO company, sends up some FUD about his interpretation of recent events, which coincidentally, reflect feelings he's had for years, and validate the strategies his company implements.

Wait, Dancey works for CCP/White Wolf now? I hadn't realized that. And he posts at RPGPundit's site -- that's kind of amusing.

Fifth Element · Apr 9, 2009

Mark Hope said:
I thought that "evergreen" was a book that sold consistently throughout the lifespan of a game's edition, like the PHB. Supplements have a limited shelf-run, but the PHB is always in stock and always sold. Guess I could be wrong on that, though. Wouldn't be the first time

No, you're quite right. Evergreen in this sense refers to a product that produces significant sales for a significant amount of time after its initital release. Most products sell when first released, then trickle off to little or nothing. Evergreen products continue to sell for a long period of time.

Ryan Dancey - D&D in a Death Spiral

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