D&D 3E/3.5 Any good Homebrew Monk Variants? [3.5e]

hunterofjello · Nov 1, 2009

One of my players that I'm DMing for has insisted on playing a Monk even though he's a powergamer and the class is horrible. The end result is that he has a character that's underpowered compared to the rest of the party even though he's the type of player that is motivated by being the most powerful.

So, does anyone here have a good homebrew variant of for a Monk that works well 3.5e? I'm thinking something along the lines of higher BAB, but any suggestions would be appreciated.

Aus_Snow · Nov 1, 2009

One option is to create a variant Fighter (so, full BAB,) with AC and unarmed combat per the normal Monk, no armour or shields allowed, still gets bonus feats per the normal Fighter, ignore the really weird stuff (i.e., most of it) from Monk levels. Oh, and maybe good Fort and Ref saves, just for good measure? d10 HD sounds reasonable.

Another is to use the Bruiser class, courtesy of 'Dr Awkward' (albeit now with a different EN World name.)

Dannyalcatraz · Nov 1, 2009

You might want to search ENWorld (either by site based search or an advanced Google search) to look for other Monk threads here- there have been lots, many with excellent ideas.

I've managed to collect some of them in the Monk Database listed in my sig.

One post of mine, from
Revised Monk

2) You might want to give the class a wider variety of "monk weapons," either by virtue of looking up the various Feats that add a particular weapon to a PC's list of monk weapons, or by giving them a little cafeteria list to choose from at 1st level to simulate the weapon choices of various schools of martial arts.

Consider this from my homebrew, for example:

Weapon Proficiencies: The Martial Artist is proficient in all simple weapons, PLUS choose one of the following groups as the PC's Melee Martial Arts Weapons and additional Ranged weapons:

1) 1 One-handed and 2 Light Martial weapons + 1 Martial Ranged Weapon
2) 3 Exotic Light weapons + 1 Martial or Exotic Ranged Weapon
3) 1 Exotic Light Weapon + 1 Exotic One-handed weapon + 1 Martial Ranged Weapon
4) 1 Martial or Exotic 2 handed weapon + 1 Martial or Exotic Ranged Weapon
5) Any 5 Simple weapons +1 Martial or Exotic Ranged weapon

These Melee Martial arts weapons may be used with Flurry of Blows

Click to expand...

milo · Nov 1, 2009

Animal Monks is an ENworld Download, has some interesting variants in there. I think it was $1. Well worth it I think.
And if he is a powergamer he should be able to use the standard monk and at least make him equally as powerful as other characters.

Celebrim · Nov 1, 2009

The entire concept of the monk is dumb IMO, in as much as the guy is asking to balanced with his bare hands against 40' long dragons and guys with magic swords in magic armor. It's just not going to happen, and its kind of unreasonable to imagine it happening both for 'realism' reasons and game balance reasons (a monk actually balanced naked against a fighter with the best equipment would be no balance at all, since not needing equipment itself represents a huge advantage).

But, if you want a completely broken powergamer's monk, may I suggest the Oathbound from Monte Cook's 'Unearthed Arcana'/'Arcana Evolved'. I wouldn't introduced it to my campaign, on the grounds that the character ends up with immunities roughly equivalent to that of a lesser diety by 20th level. It still won't bring the damage of other martial classes, it's certainly a 'playable monk'.

Arkhandus · Nov 2, 2009

Any dumber than a 4-foot dwarven fighter with a pointy stick killing 40-foot dragons and surviving what they dish out? Any dumber than a wizard gibbering nonsense he read in a book somewhere and thereby somehow nuking said dragons into radioactive dust (okay, so just ashes, but same difference)? Any dumber than a 3-foot halfling rogue stabbing said dragons in the feet with his 3-inch dagger (...against their probably-3-inch-thick scales that provide more AC than steel plate armor....) and crippling it in the process? I don't think so.

Dude's kung fu is strong. He punches a dragon in the shin and those scales crumple like the stones he practices on every week. The price he pays is that his kung fu still isn't quite as strong as a highly-magical sword, he can't make effective use out of most magic weapons and armors, and he needs more high ability scores to compensate for his uselessness with combat gear. He tends to be more squishy, and he only really comes close to the magic-sword-wielding magically-armored dude after a long time of training and fighting; at most levels, the monk is just outright worse than any other melee class at fighting in melee (and surviving there).

It's all about skill and intense dedication/training as opposed to reliance on objects. Trained martial artists can and do survive blows that would kill or break the bones of other men. And they break freaking concrete and stuff with their bare hands.

Anyway, explanation aside....... It's the Oathsworn in Monte Cook's books, and it's not much better than the Monk, just kinda different, with both pros and cons. They are tougher than a Monk, anyway, but no better in offense and with less utility/mobility and less mystical stuff.

Unfortunately, I don't have anything especially useful to contribute here right now, since I haven't gotten around to completing my Aurelia revision/variants for the Monk class yet and haven't done any notable tweaking of the class in my other campaigns so far.

One minor option, though, would be to either play a Swordsage or Warblade from the Tome of Battle: Book of Nine Swords, or simply take a few feats from that book with the Monk; Superior Unarmed Strike is useful until upper levels (since Monk base unarmed damage caps at a certain level), Snap Kick is kinda handy, and some martial stances/maneuvers through the Martial Study and Martial Stance feats could help a Monk out.

Matrixryu · Nov 2, 2009

It isn't homebrew, doesn't have higher BAB, and is a little more complex, but have you tried looking at the pathfinder variant of the monk? The tweeks in that version of the class look pretty good to me, they get a few more feats and have a ki pool to spend on their various special abilities. Monk (Pathfinder_OGC)

Ashtagon · Nov 2, 2009

Monk - Fax Encyclopedicus

Best monk variant I've seen yet.

Mon · Nov 2, 2009

In our games, we've added two class features to the monk that take care of the Flurry of Misses and M.A.D. They may have been yoinked from elsewhere, but if so it was so long ago I forget. Sorry if one or both are your idea.

Inner Strength (Ex):
When a monk of 3rd level or above attacks with an unarmed strike or a special monk weapon, he can substitute his Wisdom bonus for his Strength bonus to modify his attack roll (if it is better). He still uses his Strength to modify damage.

and

Channel The Void (Su):
Starting at 4th level, a monk can enhance his own unarmed strikes and unarmoured AC. This works like the Craft Magic Arms and Armour feat except that it only works on the monk's own body. In place of spending time crafting, he retreats to a secluded location (often a cloister) for meditation. In place of spending gold on materials, he makes an equivalent sacrifice of material wealth (to the poor, a donation to a temple, or something similar).

The monk can apply enhancement bonuses and special weapon or armour properties, but must make a Concentration check with a DC of 15 + spell level in place of any spell prerequisites he fails to meet. Success means the enhancement works, failure means it stalls for one day. Three successive failures ruins the attempt and half of the sacrifice is wasted.

---

These two features address the core of the monk problem - weak attacks and MAD.

The first reduces MAD by removing strength from the mix, without making it a complete dump stat (it still modifies damage). With one less ability score to pour resources into the monk can be more effective at hitting things. Sure, it makes Wisdom uber for monks. But that is fine by me, since it reflects the whole "don't judge me by my size" thing flavour-wise and requires three full levels to get so it isn't a no-brainer for clerics and druids to dip. Why 3rd level? To shift it away from first level, and because Still Mind isn't such a cool power that it couldn't handle a bit of company.

The second improves the monk's ability to hit and gain cool ki powers without relying on external factors such as magic items and spells. Why 4th level? Because thats when a monk gets Ki Strike, and that's when the good samurai class (the one from OA

) gets their similar feature of Ancestral Daisho. Oh, and it gives a monk a reason to take the thematically appropriate Concentration skill.

Both make for good flavour as well as a quick workable fix.

milo · Nov 2, 2009

I don't think the monk needs a fix to be a playable character myself. They make a great class on their own. The animal monks has the demon monk variant, you give up some of your other class features for wings, strength and con boosts, nat armor gain, fire and elec resistance, darkvision 120 ft, see invis, and you can drop points of wisdom to gain spellcasting levels as a sorcerer. If you do that you can take ascetic mage to use your charisma instead of wisdom for your monk abilites, if you start with a 15 or 16 in wisdom you can eventually have a 20th level caster without ever taking a level in sorcerer. I would suggest taking steadfast determination with that variant though. put all of your points into wisdom for leveling up(yes this takea even more stat points, but at level 16 you have a +4 to str and con from the class so those aren't as important when building the character). This is just a quick build.
I will be back with more ideas as I have time.