LEB Discussion Thread '10

renau1g · Jul 2, 2010

Meh, it's not really that bad, most spellcaster's will also likely have Dual implement spellcaster so its maybe a point or two to hit lower and the same on damage.

The difference between superior implements/weapons and expertise is that expertise was explicited stated by WoTC to be a fix in the breakdown of their math for higher levels, therefore if it's just a correction of their error we shouldn't all be penalized for it.

evilbob · Jul 2, 2010

Still, it's a bit difficult to understand since +1 to hit is easily the best possible feat you can take for any type of battle situation. I mean, it feels like "superior implements" were created to balance the "superior" weapons already available, and to add some flavor... but in the end, a +1 to hit is ALWAYS worth a feat. Maybe not at level 1 for some builds, and maybe not for a non-combat-focused game (does that exist in 4.0?), but otherwise it is always worth it. I dunno - sort of a side-track, here...

Velmont · Jul 2, 2010

The big difference with Expertise feat, it is it gives a +1 flat bonus, and not +1/+2/+3. So it is a strong feat but not broken.

renau1g · Jul 7, 2010

Just a note, there's another set of updates today:

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/UpdateJuly2010.pdf

Nothing major for our levels with a couple exceptions, but White Lotus Master Riposte got nerfed, Windrise Ports got hit.

Magic Missile is now auto-hit, but no damage roll...
Lead the Attack (Warlord 1) got hit, no longer lasting all encounter
Subtle weapons now must be wielded (like staff of ruin)
Free Action attacks are limited to 1/turn
Wizards Escape (lvl 6 wizard) is a daily now
Spinning Leopard Maneuver got its damage lowered
Harmonious Thunder got its wording corrected to not be auto-kill

I think that covers most of them

Velmont · Jul 7, 2010

Healer's Armor has been debuff... now it can only be use with power that use HS... one day, Pacifist Cleric will no longer be able to heal, I am quite sure!

stonegod · Jul 7, 2010

Static Shock (Art 1) is now Melee 5, not Melee or Ranged 5.

Luinnar · Jul 7, 2010

Bless and Shield of Faith are minor action now.

Big change to Magic Missile. They should of made it a new power really.

twilsemail · Jul 7, 2010

Luinnar said:
Bless and Shield of Faith are minor action now.

Big change to Magic Missile. They should of made it a new power really.

Making a new power would have ruined what they were going for, the old feel of the spell.

I'm, personally, very happy with the new MM. I've been put off by rolling "to hit" with MM for years now. Since I first rolle dup a 1e elf, MM has always hit and always done a bit of damage.

renau1g · Jul 7, 2010

My only problem with it now is that in 4e monsters have boatloads of hp, so with it not having a damage roll it won't benefit from a ton of stuff now so really... it's good if you really need to hit for a bit of damage.

In previous editions a MM could take out a kobold or goblin with one shot, they missed "capturing" this feel of the older edition.

Oh, forgot about the pacifist cleric...sorry River...soon enough you'll be corrupted by Khyber (aka the errata) and join in the destruction.