Brawler Style "Empty Hand" Definition

Kosh

First Post

• Mar 8, 2010

• #1

The definition of "Empty Hand" on page 6 of Martial Power 2 says a hand is empty when it is holding nothing else (except for a spiked gauntlet).

If I am holding an opponent with a grab, my hand is not empty, so I lose the AC and Fortitude defense bonuses.

Do I have to have a spiked gauntlet in one hand (a weapon), and and nothing (or a spiked gauntlet) in my other hand to receive the bonuses for Brawler Style?

 

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john112364

First Post

• Mar 8, 2010

• #2

"The definition of "Empty Hand" on page 6 of Martial Power 2 says a hand is empty when it is holding nothing else (except for a spiked gauntlet).

If I am holding an opponent with a grab, my hand is not empty, so I lose the AC and Fortitude defense bonuses"
This sounds about right. You would not be able defend yourself properly while trying to hold an opponent.

"Do I have to have a spiked gauntlet in one hand (a weapon), and and nothing (or a spiked gauntlet) in my other hand to receive the bonuses for Brawler Style?"
I believe that as long as you have one hand free it doesn't matter what is in the other hand.

 

DracoSuave

First Post

• Mar 8, 2010

• #3

If you have both hands either unarmed, or spike gauntlet'd, then both hands are free. Grabbing an opponent with one does not make the other not free, and you can use that to grab a second.

That's also on the same page.

 

Kosh

First Post

• Mar 8, 2010

• #4

john112364, I think you are correct. I really hope the bonus does not disappear completely whenever a character grabs anything.

DracoSuave, are you saying that a character with a longsword in one hand and a grabbed opponent in the other has a hand free? If not, then I think you are agreeing with me. I'm not sure what you are citing when you mention "the same page," so I'm not exactly sure what point you want to make.

 

keterys

First Post

• Mar 8, 2010

• #5

What he said is that you can just use two spiked gauntlets (or unarmed), and grab someone and still have a hand free.

 

Iron Sky

Procedurally Generated

• Mar 8, 2010

• #6

I believe "free" in the 4e lexicon means what mechanical-advantage granting piece of equipment is equipped in that slot, not what you are doing with it.

If you grab someone, you haven't equipped anything in that slot, so your hand is still "free".

Likewise, if you are wearing a vest, your "armor slot" is free, even though there is something there(though it might count as cloth armor) or if you're wearing twenty silver bracelets on your arm your "arms slot" is free even though you have something there.

 

S

Saeviomagy

Adventurer

• Mar 8, 2010

• #7

Iron Sky said:

I believe "free" in the 4e lexicon means what mechanical-advantage granting piece of equipment is equipped in that slot, not what you are doing with it.

If you grab someone, you haven't equipped anything in that slot, so your hand is still "free".

Likewise, if you are wearing a vest, your "armor slot" is free, even though there is something there(though it might count as cloth armor) or if you're wearing twenty silver bracelets on your arm your "arms slot" is free even though you have something there.

Click to expand...

Yeah, but in all of those cases, you could actually equip an item in the slot. If your hand is grabbing someone, you cannot wield a longsword in it simultaneously. Nor could you hold anything else and wield a longsword in it.

Therefore it would seem as though this particular slot is not "free" unless you have nothing in hand.

 

BASHMAN

Basic Action Games

• Mar 8, 2010

• #8

Isn't the word "Empty Hand" just a euphemism for martial arts? That's what "Karate" means... "Empty Hand". So I think that you can use it to grapple people w/o taking penalties- it makes more sense than a guy with a sword going around grappling people.

 

N

Neonchameleon

Legend

• Mar 8, 2010

• #9

I'd assume if you were a brawler fighter and had someone grabbed you could use them as cover - replacing one defensive bonus with another (in the end making no difference).

 

lukelightning

First Post

• Mar 8, 2010

• #10

How do the brawler abilities mesh with the gnoll claw fighter feat? Is that a viable build?