Proposal: Establish the major Evil forces at work in L4W


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Mal Malenkirk

First Post
Is the Usurper Chronos, or related to him at all, or are the two separate entirely?

He is from a previous universe. He tried to overthrow all other divinities and rule alone and triggered a war that destroyed the universe, scaterring the essence of the various immortals.

The universe then 'rebooted' in the one we have now. The Usurper's essence is currently scattered accross the uni(multi-)verse.

One relatively minor quibble: I'd be a little happier with Akneth if some of the language regarding her domination of the underworld and the drow were softened a bit.

...

Describing Yenethrocal as "the most powerful city in the underworld", for example; I feel that's a bit limiting

In the nuthsell section I compared her to Imperial rome in the underdark with spider motif instead of the eagle. Even at her absolute peak, Rome never controlled the entirety for the known world.

I say she control the majority of drow city, but not the totality and that she has hordes of slaves. I say that her capital, Yenethrocal, is the most powerful city of the underworld, but I don't think it's limiting. One city has to be the most powerful!

There is plenty of room for other powerful civilization. For example, I did hint that they ally with, rather than enslave, beholders.

Also, am I correct in assuming that this isn't intended to be a complete list of Big Bads?

Well, this is an effort to create a (nearly) complete list of the big bads. That was just my contribution. If you feel that something is missing, you go right ahead and submit something!

As I wrote in OP I am trying to establish a manageable number of archetypical, easy to use, Big Bads that fill most of the traditional niches of Evil. I am more than open to counter-suggestions, amendments etc. to coordinate with what has already been writen.

Then once we are agreed on a workable list, we promote it and encourage DMs to tie their adventure to our established BBL (Big Bads List!) when they require high powered evil behind the scene. And we keep a Wiki Log to keep track.

I’m not sure if this is an issue, but Moloch classically is cast as a deposed archdevil in D&D, rather than a demon. I don’t mind the name, though I can imagine newcomers confusing him for the former baatezu Lord of Malbolge from earlier editions.

It's just a name at this point. I am open to counter-suggestions.

A quick check on wiki showed me that Moloch was associate to bull's image and sacrifice. It suited my purposes.

I don't really know what Moloch is tied to tradionnally in D&D.

You know, biblically, Asmodeus is actually a demon of lust, not of Pride. So Asmodeus was one of the first name that popped up when I was scanning google for a lustful demon name!

Lucifer would have been a much better name for the prince of the devils, classically speaking. Of course, Asmodeus is so famous in D&D circles that I didn't let something as crass as wikipedia change my mind! ;)

---

For transparency, The Archetypes I thought of and then tried to fill are the following:

Evil-That-Man-Was-Not-Meant-To-KnoW AND Fallen Evil attempting a come back to power. Also, an evil that seeks the ends of time. (The Usurper)

An Evil that delects in suffering of all kind, that is iredeemably evil for evil's sake. (Moloch)

An Evil that is driven, ambitious and a corrupting force (Asmodeus)

An Evil that lives for conquest, that embodies 'might makes right' (Perses)

Akneth is technically another conqueror. Beside filling archetypes, the BBL also serve as a way to marshall types of monsters. Akneth came in to marhsall the forces of the underdark, a primary threat for underground based story.

From the same perspective, planar monsters are currently the main orphans of my line up.
 
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Voda Vosa

First Post
Capital suggestion Mal! I will make a full write up of an archi villian from the Blazing Desert later following your formats.
 


Voda Vosa

First Post
Coments will be welcome.

[sblock=Bolbothan the Dread]

Bolbothan is the eldest aboleth that slipped into the world from the Far Realm eons ago after the gods have began their creation. He remained and lurked in the underworld’s lakes, hunting the creatures that inhabited the place. Eventually, more of his kin came to the world, but Bolbothan being the eldest, wanted to rule over them, and he did, with a fairly big proportion of the Aboleths. His minions contructed a palace for their lord in the bottom og Tal Modan lake, one of the biggest in the underworld. The other aboleth hunted for him, brought him enthralled creatures to act as servants, and treasure. Bolbothan had a strange desire for shiny objects, which was strange due to the fact that he lived in the dark reaches of the underworld.
As the drows descended into the underworld led by th dragon Akneth, the confrontation was inevitable. As the drow empire grew, the limits of each realm clashed in war. The aboleth realm of Tal Modan sent armies composed of the large aboleth overseers with hundreds of enthralled minions, and the drows send their armies of disciplined soldiers led by the female priests. The odds were even, and each side lost and won several battles. However, after each battle lost by the drows, the aboleth gained many servants. Akneth foresaw a grim future for her children, and conceived a cunning plan to get rid of Bolbothan and his empire. She instructed her drows to poison the waters of the Tal Modan lake. Many creatures depended from that source of fresh water, so the casualties were the highest the underworld had seen.
All the aboleths’ minions were killed by the venom, and many aboleths were also slain when escaping frantically from the poison to the surface by a drow strike team.
Bolbothan was forced to emerge as well after centuries of slumber in his chambers. The huge aboleth raised over the drows and over his kin. He laid waste over the assaulting drows, but when Akneth showed up, the power of the deep dragon forced the aboleth to retreat. Bolbothan needed to escape, and enthralled the mind of one of Akneth’s most powerful priestess, and made her attack the dragon from behind. The distraction was effective, and the sluggish amphibian disappeared from sight in a blink.
After his defeat, the drow empire continued it’s expansion without any other rival to stand in their way. The remaining aboleth hide in the dark corners of the underdark alone or in small groups; but some followed Bolbothan to the surface. The elder aboleth had a plan, a plan that could take him centuries to fulfill, but he had that kind of time.
His plan was to take the surface world, to enslave the creatures of the surface to his will and then lead an attack to the underworld, and ultimately destroy the drows and their mother.
Stats: An Aboleth overseer of level 25 at least, with all that this implies. He can probably dominate other creatures apart from humanoids.

Theme:

Thralls: Most of Bolbothan’s minions are thralls dominated by the aboleth Lord. The only willingly loyal servants of Bolbothan are other aboleths and Kuo Toas.

Vengance: Bolbothan wants to see every drow dead, and every surface dweller on their knees before him in order to exterminate the drows. Although he has his priorities, if there is a chance to kill drows, Bolbothan will take it.

Water please: As his army is composed mainly by amphibious creatures, Bolbothan will establish his outposts around the transitive islands where water is abundant, and will try to dominate port cities or cities with lakes and rivers close to them.

Dominate with words:
At this stage, Bolbothan will try to subdue populatins through manipulation of their leaders and with political moves. He will have secret agents bring him information and with it he’ll plan a scheme to put a puppet in the power in order to slowly control the population. Bolbothan will rarely rely on raw military power.

It’s just a thrall: Every time that a sacrifice of a thrall will rely on a benefit to an aboleth or to the general scheme planed by them, do it. It’s just a thrall after all.

Reckless combat tactics: When there comes the time to fight, the abolths will send all their minions forward, and dominate/nuke the players from safety. Kuo Toas are to be sacrificed later, if the aboleths need to withdraw from battle, they will use them as curtain.

Forces: Bolbothan has a personal army composed by several Aboleth with their respective Aboleth servitors, and hosts of Kuo Toas and Bolbothan’s Aboleth servitors which can survive well away from their master. Bolbothan prefers to exert direct control over his forces. He also have agents of several races operating underground in thieves guilds and secret organizations; these are either voluntary of dominated. [/sblock]
 

Mal Malenkirk

First Post
What I really Like: The mind control aspect. I really like that. None of the major Evils I designed play on that aspect and it is archetypical. There should be one menacing villain that threatens to rob you of your individuality. It's a classic human fear.

Problem: You pitted the aboleth as a 'faceless horde' vs 'Small skilled force' kind of deal but if you re-read Akneth entries you'll see that while there are certainly some elite legions of drows, most of the force is composed of enslaved people and monsters that the drow gleefully sacrifice like pawns in any conflict.

I could re-write that, of course. The reason that I made Akneths legion rely on hordes of slaves was twofold; First to contrast with my other conqueror, Perses, who relies on a small number of very powerful monsters to manage his conquest, secondly to give a reason to

Bottom line: I'd rather no multiply the underworld based villains. We should keep major forces few and distinct.

Maybe we can merge these stories and make Bolbothan one of Akneth's most powerful lieutenant and the source of her slave hordes.
 

Voda Vosa

First Post
I meant that he first found her at the begging of the drow expansion, perhaps when all the slaves and trade with demons did not happen. Although Bolbothan is a villain from the underworld, he currently is in the surface, and it is a menace for the surface dwellers. At this stage he does not pose any threat to the underworld; and if I'm to be nick-pick, I'll say Bolbothan is from the Far Realm, not the underworld :p

I'm reluctant to see Bolbothan as a drow's lieutenant after the "I hate drows" background I made up. It will totally alter it's flavor.

As a side note I was about to submit Ragaman, the archmage of the seventh city of the Blazin desert.
 
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Voda Vosa

First Post
[sblock=Ragaman the Living Fortress]
The blazing Desert has six estate cities, each with it’s own government. Each city has oasis, which were the original place where the people first settled.
There are mainly humans and tieflings in all these cities, and their dressing, architecture and way of life resembles middle-age Arabia. Perhaps for a closer example, Calisham. Each city is ruled by a single person, the Ladham, who has a cohort of counselors, for each sphere of the city life: One for Food production/acquisition, another for security, another for healthcare, and so on.
All the cities have had times of peace and war, using military power to conquer some of their weaker neighbors. In the past, there was another city, deep in the heart o the desert, which almost conquered all the others. Ruled by the archmage Ragaman, the seventh city ruled all but the first. But doomsday came to the city of Asamadar, when the troops marched to the walls of the city, and began a siege that lasted 2 weeks. When the sun was setting, the last night of the site, something happened in Ragaman’s land. The entire city was swallowed by the sand. Countless lives were lost, counting the archmage; not even his magic could save the tyrant. Slowly, each nation recovered the rule over their respective lands.
In these days, the nations are in peace, but the cause of the fall of the seventh nation became apparent each passing day. Ankhegs, but not normal ones, which use to dwell under pastures, where the soil is moist and fertile. These ankhegs are red and yellow, and dig tunnels in the sand. These creatures began to appear recently, and spread from the middle of the desert, and now appear almost in the first nation’s borders. Some argue that these creatures excavated the city's basements; some even say that it was the archmage who created the vermin, and was unable to control them. What people don’t know, is that Ragaman still lives.
Ragaman was the successor of his father, the great Ladham of the seventh city of the blazing desert. His father had been a prolific ruler, and had many wives and left many offspring. The cunning Ragaman was trained in the art of magic from an early age, and upon his father’s death, he became Ladham, as he was the eldest and most lecture of his brothers. Ragaman’s first act as ruler of the seventh city was to imprison and execute all of his brothers and sisters. The next years of his regin were plagued by massacre, dark rituals, abuses of power, slavery, and war.
Ragaman developed a taste for creating golems and other constructs, even those that are vile and which mere existence is a blasphemy. Bone, flesh, iron, sand, clay, you name the golem; Ragaman had a dozen at his service.
With his army of constructs and summoned fiends, Ragaman conquered the remaining nations. Asamadar was the last city standing under other flag than Ragaman’s. It’s Ladham, a Djinn called Losador was a worthy opponent for Ragaman, and although the sage rarely was seen in the battlefield, he was there the day the siege of Asamadar began; but that is not on the history books. Ragaman and Losador debated for one day and two nights. At the end of their debate, they came to an agreement. Ragaman wanted Losador to give life to his golems, specially one big golem he had in his sanctum. The tricky Djinn agreed, and both teleported to Ragaman chambers. Losador couldn’t believe his eyes when he saw the massive golem standing on a special chamber. It’s legs like towers, it’s chest like a caslte. In one hand it hold a massive hammer, and over it’s shoulder there were three towers. Ragaman explained that the central was the control room, the second, a forge of golems, and the third was armed with arcane devices to shoot the enemies on the battlefield. He was so proud of his creation that he took Losador to the central tower. From there, Ragaman thought to control the monstrosity, and cast his spells from a safe distance. Losador for the first time wa scared. He had promised this maniac to give him the energy he needed to activate this leviathan, and was hoping to trick the mage somehow.
So a plan occurred to him. He told Ragaman that he needed him to stay ready to operate the golem when he gave it the energy, and the mage believed it. When the wizard lowered his magical protections in order to manipulate the controls, Losador trapped the wizard’s essence inside the first object he saw, a crystal ball next to the tyrant. The wizard was caught unprepared, and his soul trapped in the crystal ball. Losador laughed at the object, proud and confident of his victory. The soul of Ragaman raged inside the crystal ball, which only made Losador happier. He would leave the mage trapped in his own machine for the rest of the eternity.
The djinn teleported back to his city, and was even more contempt to behold as the golems controlled by the wizard remained motionless, and his summoned demons were returned to their native planes, as the spell that bound them was no longer in effect.
But Ragaman was far from defeat; Losador made a huge mistake in placing him inside the ‘Control Orb’. Fueling the golem with his own essence, Ragaman activated the golem. As it was still fixed to the walls and the celling, the awakening of the hulking golem was accompanied by a cave in. Ragaman was free, and seconds later, he was trapped. His castle and city fall engulfed by the collapsing basements, all over the giant golem.
Years passed since those times, now the cities are free, and Ragaman is only a bad memory, a name that mothers use to scare their sons. But this night story is far from ending: Each day, Ragaman excavated further to the surface, until one day, the three towers emerged from the sand. Now, as he finishes releasing his body, the second tower’s forges are burning, and golems are being created to fulfill their master’s desires.


Stats: This one is tricky, think of a level 25-30 colossus of the gods, armed with a hammer and shooting arcane spells from the third tower. Although now it’s completely buried, and can only attack with the tower, it could eventually unbury.

Theme:

Golems: Ragaman’s minions are golems. Once they were from almost any substance, but now they are mostly mechanical, although some of the old ones were reactivated, they are a fair minority.

Vengance: Ragaman wants Losador dead, and will stop before nothing to achieve that.

Cold minded:As Ragaman spend so many years imprisoned inside the giant golem, his human feelings have gone. He tends to be calculative, and will not rush things, no get visceral with anything or anyone, except perhaps Losador.

Rebuilder: Ragaman’s forces composed of golems need no food, need no people, need no shelter. Upon conquering, they will promptly dismantle every building (and any person left alive) to repair themselves or create more golems, and the machinery necessary to do so.

The weakness: As Ragaman’s essence is trapped inside the cristal ball in the central tower, if it happens to shatter in pieces, the wizard will reform outside the golem. That poses an advantage and a difficulty: On one side, the giant golem menace is stopped. On the other hand there is an angry archmage just in front of you who will turn you into banana pie.

The golem Forge: The second tower can produce a wide variety of golems, to use as messegers, spies, assassins, diplomatic embassadors, warriors, auxilia, etc.

Forces: Metalic golems of various sorts. The military organization and tactics is quite roman. The main force is the heavy combat golems, and there are squadrons of auxilia golems to aid those in battle against particular threats. [/sblock]
 

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