Magic Missile while blinded

MrMyth

First Post
It says: If you can't see the target (for instance, if you're blind or the target is invisible). you can't have line of sight to it even if you could draw an unblocked line between your space and the target's.

Without Line of Sight, you can't have Line of Effect, therefore you can't cast Magic Missile blinded without the perception check.

I'm sorry, but you are completely misreading some of the rules here. Line of Sight is not required to have Line of Effect. They are seperate elements. By your logic, being blind would prevent a character from making any attacks at all - I hope its self-evident how absurd that is, especially since there are specific rules for attacking enemies you can't see.

The truth is that Magic Missile automatically hits the target, even if you are blind. Provided, however, that you declare the appropriate square to attack - if you are blind and the enemy sneaks away from where you think he is, the Magic Missile may fail since you are targeting an empty square.

Now, most groups will allow other non-blinded PCs to point out to the blind PCs where the enemies are, so that will usually be enough. If that bothers you, one would instead need to have the Wizard making Perception checks to hear where an enemy is, and if they fail, force him to guess at whatever location he wanted to attack.
 

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eamon

Explorer
I'm sorry, but you are completely misreading some of the rules here. Line of Sight is not required to have Line of Effect. They are seperate elements. By your logic, being blind would prevent a character from making any attacks at all - I hope its self-evident how absurd that is, especially since there are specific rules for attacking enemies you can't see.

You really should finish reading before posting: that argument's already been made; and in fact, Minifig graciously said...
I will also openly admit it that it appears that I'm wrong, and I'm glad we've got such a great forum to discuss such things, especially with as screwy as WoTC's wording is in the books. Though, for some reason, it's sorta slow for me.. (loading, reloading and refreshing pages.. not sure if it is for anyone else..) though I'm getting used to it.
 
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the Jester

Legend
For those of you still debating the argument, both Minifig and I have conceded the argument, but are both comfortable making rulings contrary to the RAW in this case.

Just FYI, since it seems to have slipped past a number of people. ;)
 



Festivus

First Post
Page 277 of the PHB is a great page to photocopy and stick somewhere for reference. That's the conditions page, and tells you everything you need to know about immobilize and blinded.

For magic missile, as someone stated above, my ruling would be if you have line of effect, you can auto-hit with it, even if you are blinded. Flavor it however you want (perhaps the missiles have arcane sight?) to have it make sense, but it's not a huge amount of damage and should be permitted to go through.

For immobilized, it means you can't move from your square. The example of an attack being a move doesn't apply... it would if you were petrified however. Very different conditions.

Also remember the most important rule, that it be FUN for all involved. If it makes sense and is something that would be fun for the players to experience, you might have that magic missile miss when they are blinded... but have a good reason for it that makes the encounter more fun.
 



DracoSuave

First Post
For those of you still debating the argument, both Minifig and I have conceded the argument, but are both comfortable making rulings contrary to the RAW in this case.

Just FYI, since it seems to have slipped past a number of people. ;)

You can do this... but remember that you'd be doing so in cases where their target failed a stealth roll against a passive perception check that was at -10 for being blind.

If the stealth guy failed THAT badly... throw a frikken bone to the perceiver.
 

The Little Raven

First Post
One thing you forgot, DracoSuave, is that you can actively perceive something on your turn. This is a Perception roll against the creature's last Stealth check (presumably, the one that beat your Passive Perception to become hidden from you).
 

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