Pathfinder 1E Are druids overpowered in Pathfinder?

concerro

Explorer
While using wild shape? At level 5 I don't even think you could crack 20, for example, even with dumping all your cash into AC.

The wildshape Ac is lower at low levels, but at higher levels it actually makes AC go up.

What point buy does your group use? If you roll then give me an acceptable point buy for your group.

I will admit I only used wildshape for utility until I got to double digit levels.
 

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Jhaelen

First Post
What AC at what level is considered to suck? Is a 30 at level 10 considered to be good?
IMG, there was a point when the druid pc had the highest AC in the group (30). I think it was around level 11-13.

When another player rolled up a new paladin, that was the one with the highest AC (~35) at a similar level until someone created a warforged fighter 'tank' with about AC 40 at level 15.

At that point the druid had been retired (due to a crisis of faith ;)), so I cannot say how his AC would have developed.
 

Flatus Maximus

First Post
I will admit I only used wildshape for utility until I got to double digit levels.

I'll agree that it looks like AC won't suck quite as hard right around 10-12 (max out at net +6 to AC for Medium or larger, right?), but it goes downhill from there since wild shape stops getting better at 12. Before and after, it would seem that AC in wild shape is terrible.
 

concerro

Explorer
I'll agree that it looks like AC won't suck quite as hard right around 10-12 (max out at net +6 to AC for Medium or larger, right?), but it goes downhill from there since wild shape stops getting better at 12. Before and after, it would seem that AC in wild shape is terrible.

Str 20 (base 14, +2 Racial bonus, +4 enhancement)


dex 12 (base 14


con 14 (base 14


int 10 (base 10


wis 20 (base 16, +4 enhancement)


cha 8 (base 8


Spell Focus conjuration
Augment Summoning
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Combat Casting[/FONT]
Natural Spell
Heavy Armor Proficiency
Power Attack


HP: 78 HP (10d8+30)
Saving Throws
Fort: +10 Ref: +4 Will: +12



Human For;m
AC: 24 - Touch 11, Flatfooted 23 (+10 (+1 fullplate), +2 shield, +1 Ring of protection, +1 dex)



Wildshaped Dire Tiger form:
AC: 25 - Touch 8, Flatfooted 24 (+10 (+1 fullplate), +4 Natural Armor, -1 size, -1 dex, +1 Ring of protection)


Gear:[FONT=NexusSansOT, sans-serif]62,000 gp[/FONT]


19,300 +1 Wild Fullplate (Dragonhide)
157 MW Heavy Wooden Shield
5,000 Amulet of Mighty Fists +1
16,000 Belt of Giant Str +4
16,000 Headband of Wisdom +4
1,000 Cloak of Resistance +1
2,315 +1 scimitar
2,000 Ring of Protection +1


228 spare gold


Eventually more gold allows me to add the shield bonus to wildshape, and the amulet of natural armor means more AC. I think the druid's AC gets better by comparison with level, not worse but it does take planning. I had an AC of about 30 at level 11, but I had more money of course at level 11.


PS: I will post a level 15 build tomorrow.

I will need an AC of 36 minimum to avoid CR 15 monsters from smacking me in the face constantly so I am shooting for 40.
 

concerro

Explorer
I did not forget about the build. Personal problems came up. I will see if I can get to 40 in 5 levels. It might not be for a few days though.
 

Realize it has been a while, but I've been playing a druid and wrestling with these same problems.

I actually have a plan to flip from melee to spell caster/controller at level 11 - but to get there I take a level of monk for the AC bonus from wisdom

At level 10, and for only 18,000 gp I can get a 30 AC wildshaped as huge megaraptor


  • 0 gp Size -2
  • 0 gp Dex 12 +1
  • 0 gp Natural Armor (WS) +6
  • 0 gp Barkskin +3
  • 1000 gp Pearl of Power I (Mage Armor, cast by party wiz) +4
  • 4000 gp +2 Headband of Wisdom (WIS 21) +5
  • 8000 gp +2 Ring of Protection +2
  • 5000 gp Dusty Rose Ioun Stone +1

10-2+1+6+3+4+5+2+1 = 30


At level 13, and for 69,000 gp I can get a 40 AC (22 Touch) as a huge air elemental


  • 0 gp Size -2
  • 0 gp Dex 20 +5
  • 0 gp Natural Armor (WS) +4
  • 0 gp Barkskin +5
  • 4000 gp Headband of Wisdom (WIS 23) +6
  • 4000 gp +2 Belt of Dexterity +1
  • 5000 gp Dusty Rose Ioun Stone +1
  • 8000 gp +2 Ring of Protection +2
  • 8000 gp Ring of Shielding +2
  • 36,000 gp Bracers of Armor +6

10-2+5+4+5+6+1+1+2+2+6 = 40 AC


While I may only get 2 slam attacks as an elemental, I can start moving into a battlefield controller without worrying too much about getting whacked or trapped by my own spells. Also worth noting - according to PFd20SRD, wealth at level 13 should be approx 140k, so this spends less than half of that! Important since the DM appears to be quite stingy on party gold.

Am I missing something? I realize the monk level carries the cost of 20th level capstone power - but c'mon, that is at the very end of a long campaign and may NEVER be reached ;0 Those monk saves and AC bonus are going to be very worthwhile, and having 6 AoO with combat reflexes from Monk bonus feat could prove pretty useful.
 

concerro

Explorer
If your game ends on an even level the monk idea may not hurt you, but if it ends on an odd level then that lost level of spells may be an issue. I think that if you had normal gold you would have decent AC. I had an AC of 27-30 by level 11 in a real game. It was costly thought since I had to put the wildshape enhancement on both my armor and my shield. I do think that if a GM is going to hold back with gold he should say so up front, but then again he may not feel like he is holding back.

In short: I think what is best differs from game to game.
 

kelseus

First Post
Not to get the thread off topic but if you retain your armor bonus from wild armor/shield, wouldn't that be considered "wearing" armor? I ask b/c the monk bonus to AC specifically states that it only applies when wearing no armor.
 


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