Special Conversion Thread: Lycanthropes and their ilk

freyar said:

Ok, so are we going to make a dire lycanthrope template?

Click to expand...

Yes!

Ok, then, just make the following changes to a regular lycanthrope? (Other than just adding "dire" places, I've bolded the changes.)

CREATING A DIRE LYCANTHROPE

“Dire Lycanthrope” is a template that can be added to any humanoid or giant (referred to hereafter as the base creature). The dire lycanthrope template can be inherited (for natural lycanthropes) or acquired (for afflicted lycanthropes). Becoming a dire lycanthrope is very much like multiclassing as an animal and gaining the appropriate Hit Dice.

Size and Type: The base creature’s type does not change, but the creature gains the shapechanger subtype. The dire lycanthrope takes on the characteristics of some type of carnivorous or omnivorous creature of the animal type (referred to hereafter as the base animal).

This animal can be any predator, scavenger, or omnivore whose size is within two size categories of the base creature’s size (Small, Medium, or Large for a Medium base creature) and must have good Will saves (ie, is a dire animal, has the Dire SQ, or otherwise has good Will saves). Dire lycanthropes can also adopt a hybrid shape that combines features of the base creature and the base animal. A dire lycanthrope’s hybrid form is the same size as the base animal or the base creature, whichever is larger.

A dire lycanthrope uses either the base creature’s or the base animal’s statistics and special abilities in addition to those described here.

....

Special Attacks: A dire lycanthrope retains the special attacks of the base creature or base animal, depending on which form it is using, and also gains the special attacks described below.

A dire lycanthrope’s hybrid form gains any special attacks of the base animal. A dire lycanthrope spellcaster cannot cast spells with verbal, somatic, or material components while in animal form, or spells with verbal components while in hybrid form.

....

freyar said:

Ok, then, just make the following changes to a regular lycanthrope? (Other than just adding "dire" places, I've bolded the changes.)

CREATING A DIRE LYCANTHROPE

“Dire Lycanthrope” is a template that can be added to any humanoid or giant (referred to hereafter as the base creature). The dire lycanthrope template can be inherited (for natural lycanthropes) or acquired (for afflicted lycanthropes). Becoming a dire lycanthrope is very much like multiclassing as an animal and gaining the appropriate Hit Dice.

Size and Type: The base creature’s type does not change, but the creature gains the shapechanger subtype. The dire lycanthrope takes on the characteristics of some type of carnivorous or omnivorous creature of the animal type (referred to hereafter as the base animal).

Click to expand...

Looks fine up to here, but I think this size bit needs work:

freyar said:

This animal can be any predator, scavenger, or omnivore whose size is within two size categories of the base creature’s size (Small, Medium, or Large for a Medium base creature) and must have good Will saves (ie, is a dire animal, has the Dire SQ, or otherwise has good Will saves). Dire lycanthropes can also adopt a hybrid shape that combines features of the base creature and the base animal. A dire lycanthrope’s hybrid form is the same size as the base animal or the base creature, whichever is larger.

Click to expand...

For a start, dire animals are almost the same size or bigger than the regular creature, so I wouldn't have them two sizes smaller (but don't mind 2 sizes LARGER).

freyar said:

Special Attacks: A dire lycanthrope retains the special attacks of the base creature or base animal, depending on which form it is using, and also gains the special attacks described below.

Click to expand...

The above is fine, but I was wondering whether the hybrid form would use the base creature's special attacks (if any) as well.

Added to Homebrews.

Ready for the smilodon, then? Looks ok to me.

freyar said:

Ready for the smilodon, then? Looks ok to me.

Click to expand...

Sure, that'll put it to the test.

Shade said:

Sure, that'll put it to the test.

Click to expand...

Note that I gave the Weresabre Working Draft Multiattack as a bonus feat, because the Frostburn Smilodon had a -2 penalty to its secondary attacks. I also outlined some suggestions for "Diring" the Smilodon.

If we're keeping the bonus Multiattack, we'd better modify the Dire Lycanthrope Template's feat section:

Feats: Add the base animal's feats to the base creature's. If this results in a dire lycanthrope having the same feat twice, the lycanthrope gains no additional benefit unless the feat normally can be taken more once, in which case the duplicated feat works as noted in the feat description. This process may give the lycanthrope more feats than a character of its total Hit Dice would normally be entitled to; if this occurs, any "extra" feats are denoted as bonus feats.

It’s possible that a dire lycanthrope cannot meet the prerequisites for all its feats when in humanoid form. If this occurs, the lycanthrope still has the feats, but cannot use them when in humanoid form.

A dire lycanthrope receives Iron Will and Multiattack as bonus feats.

I'll edit the "Working Draft" of the Weresabre incorporating the above.

Oh yes, it was missing a feat for being a 1st level warrior - I decided on Power Attack, since that goes well with a Greataxe.

Updated Weresabre Working Draft.

I think we've just got the skills, flavour and tactics to figure out.

It's looking pretty good!

Since it is better than a typical lycanthrope, should the CR adjustment be higher? I definitely think LA should go up by +1 or more. Maybe by +1, and an additional +1/2 (rounded down) per special attack?

I can endorse adding Multiattack, but why do we need Iron Will if it already has good saves from the dire animal?

CR should probably be higher. CR +1 at all base animal HD levels?