D&D 3E/3.5 3.5: newb needs a little help with Hellfire Warlock build

Particle_Man · Mar 15, 2011

Hexer said:
- Hellfire Blast is treated in the same way as a warlocks eldritch essences, it can be mixed with blast shapes but not with other essences)

That being the case you probably want to look into ways to increase your caster level check to overcome SR, detailed earlier in this thread.

Hexer · Mar 16, 2011

Particle_Man said:
That being the case you probably want to look into ways to increase your caster level check to overcome SR, detailed earlier in this thread.

Yea, I'll look into that.

Also I'm thinking about taking some SLA-equivalent to a meta-magic feat for Hellfire blast to make sure whichever poor bastard makes me use hellfire blast WILL regret it. Maybe maximise SLA?

Particle_Man · Mar 16, 2011

Hexer said:
Yea, I'll look into that.

Also I'm thinking about taking some SLA-equivalent to a meta-magic feat for Hellfire blast to make sure whichever poor bastard makes me use hellfire blast WILL regret it. Maybe maximise SLA?

Sounds good. If Hellfire essence is at 1st level (and you don't have a shape on it) then you only have to be, what, 10th caster level to maximize it (6th to empower it)? So three times a day you can punish your enemies!

Hexer · Mar 16, 2011

Particle_Man said:
Sounds good. If Hellfire essence is at 1st level (and you don't have a shape on it) then you only have to be, what, 10th caster level to maximize it (6th to empower it)? So three times a day you can punish your enemies!

Exactly what I was thinking. Char will start at lvl12 (lvl9 warlock, lvl3 hellfire warlock, overall lvl12 caster).

I also thought about doing something like that to the standard eldritch blast though. Just so I'd pack some additional punch without having to take the CON damage every time.
But maybe that would be a waste of a feat?

Is taking the cone blastshape a good idea or do others (like chain) work better for hitting multiple targets?

Particle_Man · Mar 16, 2011

Hexer said:
Exactly what I was thinking. Char will start at lvl12 (lvl9 warlock, lvl3 hellfire warlock, overall lvl12 caster).

I also thought about doing something like that to the standard eldritch blast though. Just so I'd pack some additional punch without having to take the CON damage every time.
But maybe that would be a waste of a feat?

Is taking the cone blastshape a good idea or do others (like chain) work better for hitting multiple targets?

Lessee no binder level eh? You like living dangerously.

You could take the feat for maximize spell-like ability eldrich blast and decide day by day whether to make a hellfire blast or regular eldritch blast maximized. It is nice to have the option in your pocket, at least.

Personally I prefer chain to cone as I don't like being close enough to the bad guys to need cone. Plus they get a save for half-damage and you are already not doing as much damage as you want.

But hellfire does get added to all in the cone, so maybe that tips the balance.

Hexer · Mar 16, 2011

Particle_Man said:
Lessee no binder level eh? You like living dangerously.

You could take the feat for maximize spell-like ability eldrich blast and decide day by day whether to make a hellfire blast or regular eldritch blast maximized. It is nice to have the option in your pocket, at least.

Personally I prefer chain to cone as I don't like being close enough to the bad guys to need cone. Plus they get a save for half-damage and you are already not doing as much damage as you want.

But hellfire does get added to all in the cone, so maybe that tips the balance.

Decide day by day? But one Maximise feat only works on one ability, meaning either Eldritch blast OR Hellfire blast if I'm not mistaken... (because using HB CHANGES the eldritch blast into a hellfire blast)

hmmmm if I remember correctly, chain gets weaker damage each additional target, right? how was this for cone? I gotta reread I guess... BUT as far as I get it, no matter the number of targets, each one gets the FULL additional hellfire damage, right?

Particle_Man · Mar 17, 2011

Hexer said:
Decide day by day? But one Maximise feat only works on one ability, meaning either Eldritch blast OR Hellfire blast if I'm not mistaken... (because using HB CHANGES the eldritch blast into a hellfire blast)

Nope it works for all of them, but still no more than 3x/day total and some options might not be available to you until higher level (because of the caster level requirement going up with the level of the essence or shape going up).

hmmmm if I remember correctly, chain gets weaker damage each additional target, right? how was this for cone? I gotta reread I guess... BUT as far as I get it, no matter the number of targets, each one gets the FULL additional hellfire damage, right?

Chain gets weaker after the first one. Cone is full strength to all but, unlike chain, the victims get to save for half damage. On the plus side, you don't need to roll to hit, like you do with chain. But generally the rolls to hit are easy to make with ranged touch attacks while the save DC on the cone will not be high enough for you to have as easy a time doing full damage (and if the enemies have evasion, they might avoid damage entirely).

Dandu · Mar 17, 2011

Chain is less likely to incur friendly fire. It deals less damage, but if you use essences like Repelling Blast, whose primary focus is on battlefield control, or Utterdark Blast, which level drains people regardless of how much damage is dealt, then it matters less.

Hexer · Mar 21, 2011

Finally the char is nearly completed

I ditched point blank shot and precise shot, feats I got are:

Eyes of the Abyss (Abyssal Heritor)
Vestigial Wings (Abyssal Heritor)
Maximise Spelllike Ability (Hellfire Blast)
Extra Invocation (Eldritch Chain)
Extra Invocation (Invisibility)
Still one feat left to spend, I might just take another Extra to get the cursing invocation

Invocations I have:
Eldritch blast
Hellfire blast
Hellfire infusion
Hellfire shield
invisibility
eldritch chain
chilling tentacles
entropic warding
spiderwalk
flee the scene
hellrime blast
Balefull Utterance

hmmm I dont have the char-sheet with me right now but that only lists 6 invocations without those I got through the extra feat, hellfire warlock and eldritch blast... at level12 I should have 7 though so I guess I forgot something, if not, this would either give me Curse of Despair or free up one of the Extra Invocations for a different feat.... gotta check when I'm home this evening

irdeggman · Mar 21, 2011

At 12th level a warlock gets the following breakdown of invocations:

Least - 3 (Baleful utterance, Entropic warding, spiderwalk)
Lesser - 3 (hellrime blast, eldritch chain, flee the seen)
Greater - 1 (chilling tentacles)
Dark - 0

I am not sure how the helfire warlock adds to the mix but I am assuming it is a +1 level for invocations which makes it the same progression as a warlock.

Also extra invocation allows adding an extra invocation of 1 level lower than normal. Can't take it until at least 6th level (which grant 1 more least invocation, 11th level to get an extra least - a 12th level warlock can't gain an extra greater). So taking the feat twice would be your 6th, 9th or 12th level feats. So you could get 2 least or 1 least and 1 lesser. Can't get both eldritch chain and walk unseen {invisibility} using the extra invocation feat.

Extra invocations:

Walk unseen {invisibility} - lesser using 12th level feat.

XXXX - least using 6th or 9th level feat