Proposal: Lower the Item level of the Endless Quiver

Walking Dad

First Post

• Apr 28, 2011

• #1

After reading this thread:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/4e-discussion/305151-infinite-quiver.html

I was wondering why we never fixed this.

I propose the reduction of the Item level to level 3.

 

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twilsemail

First Post

• Apr 28, 2011

• #2

I am cross-posting a counter proposal I put out in LEB. Even at level 2 an endless quiver isn't worth the gold. It may be worth getting rid of the frustration of book-keeping. In a normal game, you'd have to adventure for 15 or so levels to make up the cost with the average ranged weapon user. In L4W you'd need to adventure far longer (possibly longer than the game allows) as we have double rewards from encounters and time XP.

How about this?

Counter-proposal: Remove the line "Ammunition is used up when you fire it from a projectile weapon." from the ammunition description.

It seems generally unfair that, when presented with a long campaign/adventure, a ranged weapon user can simply run out of usefulness. I think this is especially true as they should be able to recover a majority of their arrows/bolts/random rocks on the ground.

 

renau1g

First Post

• Apr 28, 2011

• #3

4e does away with a lot of the minutia of adventuring (tracking rations, water, arrows, etc) and is better for it IMO (exception being Dark Sun, that needs to have the more grittiness of tracking water/food). Personally I have never reviewed a sheet to make sure the PC tracked arrows spent. Now.... a ranger could plow through 16 shots or so each fight at 1st level just using twin strike, but yeah in the grand scheme of things who cares. Did Tolkien go into great detail of Legolas' arrow retrieval/fletching, or did he focus on the more important matters?

 

twilsemail

First Post

• Apr 28, 2011

• #4

renau1g said:

4e does away with a lot of the minutia of adventuring (tracking rations, water, arrows, etc) and is better for it IMO (exception being Dark Sun, that needs to have the more grittiness of tracking water/food). Personally I have never reviewed a sheet to make sure the PC tracked arrows spent. Now.... a ranger could plow through 16 shots or so each fight at 1st level just using twin strike, but yeah in the grand scheme of things who cares.

Click to expand...

Agreed. The only reason I put in the counter proposal was so that a player doesn't get ambushed with ammo tracking by a new DM. I haven't seen ammo tracking since the first PHB came out, so I didn't really think it was a big deal.

renau1g said:

Did Tolkien go into great detail of Legolas' arrow retrieval/fletching, or did he focus on the more important matters?

Click to expand...

Have you read the Silmarillion? I think "important" for Tolkien was a bit up in the air sometimes.

 

H

horticulture

Slightly entitled.

• Apr 28, 2011

• #5

I have to agree with both twilsemail and renau1g. The only time I'll require a PC to track ammo is for any magical ammunition they get. Mundane ammo is, essentially, infinite by default.

I do like the counter-proposal put forth by twilsemail and the reasoning behind it, however. We could use it as a safety net, so to speak.

 

twilsemail

First Post

• Apr 28, 2011

• #6

I'm also going to toss out there that I'm in no way married to the above counter-proposal. I play a ranged PC and have no issue dropping 2-3 gold every encounter for ammo. I just figured that, were we to adjust something, it would be better to adjust the rule instead of the item.

 

Dekana

Explorer

• Apr 28, 2011

• #7

I'll make a counter-counter proposal: magic ranged weapons have automatically returning ammunition in the same way that magic thrown weapons do. So you have to track ammunition for a level or two, and after that it's a given that you can afford enough arrows to last forever.

 

Walking Dad

First Post

• Apr 28, 2011

• #8

I like the counter-proposal but would like to limit it to magic weapons.

Edit: ninja'd by Dekana...

 

Last edited: Apr 28, 2011

garyh

First Post

• Apr 29, 2011

• #9

I've never, in any of my many, many games, made PC's track ammo or scene another DM do so. I'm happy to completely get rid of ammo (except for the magical stuff, of course).

 

covaithe

Explorer

• Apr 29, 2011

• #10

I recently saw someone in an adventure here ask if they could recover arrows from dead archery-based enemies. I was slightly shocked, because I don't remember ever seeing anyone else care about ammunition in L4W. I haven't missed it. That kind of minor bookkeeping is not what 4e is about.