howandwhy99
Adventurer
Acererak must be listening! 
I've noticed the thread numbers have been reversed since it reached 2 pages.
I've noticed the thread numbers have been reversed since it reached 2 pages.
WIR S1 Tomb of Horrors [SPOILERS!! SPOILERS EVERYWHERE!!]
Gentlegamer
Adventurer
I thought I was the only one seeing the thread pages reversed from the index!
Patryn of Elvenshae
First Post
Nope - I saw it, too, and I was wondering if I had flipped some setting, somewhere, accidentally.
Dm_from_Brazil
First Post
This line is the greatest proof that the Tomb was made to challenge the players, and not the characters: "night´s good color" is ORANGE, the color that is good to wear at night/that has good visibility at night.
So the line says: shun the devil green face (as it will kill you), press the lights up to orange and you are on your way (the way of those of great valor/the way of great valor, great rewards)...
And, also, the next stanza is also about the Arch of Mist: "If shades of red stand for blood..." - as, walking through the archway ON the red tiles path will take the characters to room 11.
Ultimatecalibur addressed this. But it should also be noted that this would make a very poor interpretation of how gates work: With the way most people walk, this would result in their arms being sheared off as they swung them back and forth while walking through the arch. The Tomb of Horrors is cruel; but that's probably excessive.
In this case, of course, it works just fine.
But, in general, the point isn't that any one of these methods is foolproof in all possible situations. It's that smart parties will gather information before committing themselves full-force and irrevocably to a course of action. And by 10th-14th level, AD&D parties have a lot of resources available to them for gathering information. And if those means of gathering information fail to satisfactorily elucidate the situation while other possible courses remain open to them, then smart parties will also walk away.
If you treat the tomb like a big slot machine where you just poke at stuff randomly until you are either killed or rewarded as a result, then your life expectancy is going to be short. If you treat the unknown with healthy respect; try to learn as much as you can; and then make as informed a decision as possible, then your odds of survival will greatly increase.
(And while the Tomb of Horrors certainly intensifies this, I've found it to be generally pretty true in virtually any situation: Smart parties that investigate before leaping in will tend to survive longer and suffer fewer TPKs than parties that are reckless and thoughtless.)
That's an interpretation I haven't heard before. I'm not sure I'm convinced, and here's why.
I interpret "night's good color to refer to Area 10, which is where the PC's will eventually wind up if they go through the arch at Area 6. The way out of Area 10 is through a tunnel hidden by a black sphere. There is an orange sphere in Area 10, but it's a trap.
I don't want to get ahead of myself, but if "night's good color" doesn't refer to the proper exit from Area 10, then I'm not sure there is a clue to that Area. And (as I'll discuss when we get there) I really, really think the PC's need a clue there.
Area 7. The Forsaken Prison
If you made it here, you screwed up.
Those who walk through Area 5. The Arch of Mist without solving the riddle of the Simon Says Stones are teleported to the Forsaken Prison. It's a "miserable cubicle" 10 feet square and 10 feet high. There is no visible way in or out, "and even a magical means of detection will not indicate any. There are 3 iron levers set in the south wall.
To get out, you have to simultaneously push all 3 levers straight up. That will open a trapdoor in the ceiling that leads to a little crawlspace. Following the crawlspace eventually takes you back to the Entrance Hall. If you use "magical vision means" or tap in the right place, you can find a secret door in the ceiling of the crawlspace that takes you to Area 13.
If you push the levers straight down, the floor under you turns into a pit. D'oh! The pit is 100' deep and falling in does 10d10 points of damage (average 55). Surprisingly, there are no poisoned spikes in the pit. However, you only have 1 turn to get out before the trapdoor closes and seals you inside.
Do anything else you care to do with the levers. It won't have any effect.
IMO: The Forsaken Prison is obviously a punishment room. You get here by failing to solve Area 5. It's a pretty boring place. No clues, no brightly colored mosaics, no picture -- just them 3 levers. If there's a way to solve the lever "puzzle" other than trial and error, I'd like to hear it. As far as I can tell, there are no clues or hints or anything to guide the players.
The pit trap is fairly deadly. The pregens have pretty good Constitutions, and I'd guess that a fair number of them will survive the fall. Those who do risk starving to death in the dark unless they can climb out in 1 turn. (Refresh my memory: 1 turn is 10 minutes, right?) In my experience, that won't be too hard. M-U's should be able to fly or levitate (or just teleport the hell out). Thieves climb. And any party that doesn't have 100 feet of ropes with grappling hooks deserves what they get.
Also: "miserable cubicle" makes me glad I have an office with a window.
If you made it here, you screwed up.
Those who walk through Area 5. The Arch of Mist without solving the riddle of the Simon Says Stones are teleported to the Forsaken Prison. It's a "miserable cubicle" 10 feet square and 10 feet high. There is no visible way in or out, "and even a magical means of detection will not indicate any. There are 3 iron levers set in the south wall.
To get out, you have to simultaneously push all 3 levers straight up. That will open a trapdoor in the ceiling that leads to a little crawlspace. Following the crawlspace eventually takes you back to the Entrance Hall. If you use "magical vision means" or tap in the right place, you can find a secret door in the ceiling of the crawlspace that takes you to Area 13.
If you push the levers straight down, the floor under you turns into a pit. D'oh! The pit is 100' deep and falling in does 10d10 points of damage (average 55). Surprisingly, there are no poisoned spikes in the pit. However, you only have 1 turn to get out before the trapdoor closes and seals you inside.
Do anything else you care to do with the levers. It won't have any effect.
IMO: The Forsaken Prison is obviously a punishment room. You get here by failing to solve Area 5. It's a pretty boring place. No clues, no brightly colored mosaics, no picture -- just them 3 levers. If there's a way to solve the lever "puzzle" other than trial and error, I'd like to hear it. As far as I can tell, there are no clues or hints or anything to guide the players.
The pit trap is fairly deadly. The pregens have pretty good Constitutions, and I'd guess that a fair number of them will survive the fall. Those who do risk starving to death in the dark unless they can climb out in 1 turn. (Refresh my memory: 1 turn is 10 minutes, right?) In my experience, that won't be too hard. M-U's should be able to fly or levitate (or just teleport the hell out). Thieves climb. And any party that doesn't have 100 feet of ropes with grappling hooks deserves what they get.
Also: "miserable cubicle" makes me glad I have an office with a window.
Ultimatecalibur
Explorer
Up for ceiling, down for floor? Pretty simple logic there.
If the combinations to open the ceiling and floor were random combinations of up, down and middle you might have a point about being difficult to figure out.
If the combinations to open the ceiling and floor were random combinations of up, down and middle you might have a point about being difficult to figure out.
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