Lair Assault format

kerbarian · Aug 14, 2011

The description of Lair Assault says "Each challenge is a mega-encounter that plays in just a few hours". Does anyone know if that means it's a single encounter per the game term, or whether there might be a short rest or other break somewhere in the middle?

I've been thinking about possible party compositions to try it out, and if it's actually a single encounter, that means dailies with encounter-long effects will be disproportionately powerful -- Moment of Glory, summons, stances, etc.

I also haven't seen anything about the party sizes it will accept. My guess is that it will scale for parties of 4-6, but it would be good to get confirmation on that.

Feeroper · Aug 14, 2011

It is a single encounter, but with fiddly bits for DMs to tweak to change things up here and there. It's supposed to be a super encounter, but will still just count as 1 so action points and dailies will be expected to be used. The intention is that players will run this a few times over the course of 3 months it is available (before they change to the next one).

It is written for 5 but can be adjusted for 4 and 6 of course. They also have some special "achievment" style rewards you can earn (IE: die by lava, complete as a group consisting of one race etc etc...)

This is the info they supplied at the public play seminar at Gen Con.

Dice4Hire · Aug 14, 2011

I really hope they publish these. They sound like a lot of fun

Tony Vargas · Aug 14, 2011

I think I've heard that the 'mega encounter' could be two encounters, maybe even with a skill challenge in there. Whether you get to take a short rest at any point probably depends on the design, and how the DM handles it. Considering the DM is /supposed/ to take an adversarial aproach, I wouldn't be too keen to rest...

Matt James · Aug 14, 2011

No short rests.

The encounter may alter at some point during play, but this program is designed specifically for those groups that like to take on hellish odds.

kerbarian · Aug 14, 2011

Matt James said:
No short rests.

The encounter may alter at some point during play, but this program is designed specifically for those groups that like to take on hellish odds.

Interesting -- do you know if there's some sort of break in the encounter that would cause encounter-duration powers to expire, even if the party doesn't get to rest?

If not, it's hard to imagine not bringing a cleric with Moment of Glory. Probably a mul, so they can't just stun you to break the sustain

.

Tony Vargas · Aug 14, 2011

Nod. If it's mechanically a single encounter, encounters and dailies have equivalent availability. Daily utilities look a lot better compared to encounter options and classes w/o dailies are just hosed.

A break of some sort - a milestone of sorts that re-charges encounter powers, an effect that 'dispels' whole-encounter-durration powers, or an actual short rest - would still leave encounters undervalued relative to dailies, since they're presumably balanced around the 'average' 4-5 encounter day. And, of course, surge-triggers become very valuable, and going through all your surges becomes unlikely (unless there are massive surge-draining attacks all over the place, which, there very well might be in a no-hoses-barred killer dungeon).

Saracenus · Aug 14, 2011

I think you all are making some pretty unsound assumptions about this program.

If you played (or DMed Ultimate Dungeon Delve, like I have) you know what I am talking about.

You will find that your resources are going to be taxed in ways you haven't dreamed of in normal play.

These encounters will be staggeringly unfair with the DM running full tactical mode trying to kill your PCs (within the rules of the game).

The folks that have play tested this program are under NDAs so they cannot speak to the specifics (and I haven't seen the kits yet).

Good Hunting,

Matt James · Aug 14, 2011

I designed the third Lair Assault that will be coming out when HotFW releases (I believe). Saracenus is correct. This isn't a standard encounter. It will tax any normal group. There are twists, turns, and ultimately an unfair amount of creatures and/or power coming at the PCs. It's designed specifically to challenge those who enjoy the combat aspect of the game. It's brutal. Some people won't like it. Others will absolutely love it.

Dice4Hire · Aug 14, 2011

Saracenus said:
You will find that your resources are going to be taxed in ways you haven't dreamed of in normal play.

These encounters will be staggeringly unfair with the DM running full tactical mode trying to kill your PCs (within the rules of the game).

And this is bad..... how?

In a regular game, sure, character death sucks, but this will be a totally different way to play.

Do you mourn your king when he falls in chess?