Proposal: Streamlined traits

Systole · Mar 10, 2012

Since this discussion has come up a couple times now, I'm submitting Streamlined Traits for discussion. The original thread is here, along with a spirited discussion and a rant or two by yours truly. The purpose behind these traits is really to cut through all of the complex rules and categories that I believe detract from using traits as a good RP tool, and the reskinning of the same damn trait over and over again.

I've used these traits in a home game, and I haven't seen any balance issues come out of it. RP-wise, I found that it actually gives players a lot more room to develop the characters they want without having to shoehorn themselves into published fluff. One player took a K:Engineering/K:Nature trait that made perfect sense given her character background, but doesn't actually exist in the SRD.

Note: I've changed the names of the traits from the original thread.

GM:

Knowlegeable
Choose two Knowledge skills. You gain a +1 trait bonus to both of those skills, and make one of those two Knowledge skills a permanent class skill. You can choose this trait multiple times, although you must select different Knowledge skills each time.

Resilient
Choose either Fortitude, Reflex, or Will. You gain a +1 trait bonus to that type of save. You can choose this trait multiple times, although you must select a different save category each time.

Capable
Choose any skill other than Perception. You gain a +1 trait bonus to that skill and it becomes a permanent class skill. You can choose this trait multiple times, although you must select a different skill each time.

Putting these traits into play does bring up the secondary issue of how to categorize them. In my home game, I just threw away the idea of trait categories and allowed players to select whatever they wanted. (Again, no balance issues noted.) This may be a bit of a radical departure, and I'm not sure if this is a step LPF wants to take.

As I see it, there are three ways of incorporating these traits into the trait system. From least conservative to most conservative:

Abolish trait categories.
Keep the categories. Put these traits in a "General" category. Allow more than one selection from General but keep the limitation of one trait per category elsewhere.
Keep the categories, and only allow a single selection from General traits, just like every other category.

perrinmiller · Mar 10, 2012

I vote YEA. Though I would add Perception back in. I know Systole has a thing against that skill, but I fail to see why you cannot have that as a Capable Trait. Though I do see most people taking it like the Trait to get +2 to Initiative.

IronWolf · Mar 10, 2012

I am not sure why Perception is excluded? What about popular traits like Reactionary? Is it deemed too powerful and why it is excluded?

Satin Knights · Mar 10, 2012

Since Perception is the most used skill in the game, it would become the automatic default, kind of like what Reactionary is now for most people. Reactionary wouldn't be banned with this proposal, it would just have competition for first choice with Capable Perception, if that was allowed.

YES to number 2.

I want Perception included, but I can justify its exclusion.

GlassEye · Mar 10, 2012

I say YES to option 1, although obviously I would accept a less liberal option as well. Also, YES to including Perception in the options for 'Capable'.

IronWolf · Mar 10, 2012

Satin Knights said:
Since Perception is the most used skill in the game, it would become the automatic default, kind of like what Reactionary is now for most people. Reactionary wouldn't be banned with this proposal, it would just have competition for first choice with Capable Perception, if that was allowed.

YES to number 2.

I want Perception included, but I can justify its exclusion.

Ah - so these are in addition to the traits that are already out there? We wouldn't be taking any of those options away, just adding these so we can stop playing the scour the books for a trait that fits what you envision and simply adopt one of these with your own fluff?

perrinmiller · Mar 10, 2012

I should have specified, option 2 for my yes.

kinem · Mar 10, 2012

Who can vote on these things?

My concern about relaxing the arbitrary and stupid restriction on picking more than one trait from a list is that the magic traits are too good.

Magical Lineage (pick a spell that you can metamagic at 1 less spell level increase) is the best trait in the game, and certainly better than an average feat. If it were a feat everyone would take it. The only reason some casters don't take the trait is to grab another good magic trait, such as Gifted Adept (+1 caster level to 1 spell), Two-World Magic (gives a magus touch of fatigue for an extra weapon attack every round), or Focused Mind (+2 to concentration, doesn't sound like much but stacks with Combat Casting and if you take both you often can cast low level spells defensively automatically).

Qik · Mar 10, 2012

kinem said:
Who can vote on these things?

Only judges' votes are official, but everyone's welcome/encouraged to weigh in.

Systole · Mar 12, 2012

Perception is the most used skill in the game, and it has a very real combat use since it often determines whether a character acts in a surprise round or not. In that way, Perception is basically "Initiative, the skill," in addition to everything else that Perception does.

If Capable

erception were allowed, this trait basically would be a must-have trait for every class without Perception in the game, as it is basically a straight-up +4 to Perception checks (class skill +3, trait bonus +1). Wizards and other casters already have a "trait tax" for the Concentration trait and the Initiative trait; making another one is just adding insult to injury.

If you want to have a trait for Perception as a class skill, I strongly recommend that that a separate trait be made without the additional +1. It's already understood that not all skills are created equal, otherwise there wouldn't be a separate category for Knowledges, so I don't think it's too far a stretch to add this one.

GM:

Astute
Perception becomes a permanent class skill for you.