D&D 4th Edition D&D Next Q&A




What's on your mind?

+ Log in or register to post
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 69

Thread: D&D Next Q&A

Hybrid View

  1. #1

    D&D Next Q&A

    D&D Next Q&A with Rodney Thompson is the new home for Rule-of-Three. You've got questionsÔ??we've got answers! This week, these include how to define the "adventuring day".

    Read D&D Next Q&A on D&D Insider here!



  2. #2
    Registered User
    Thaumaturgist (Lvl 9)

    Dark Mistress's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    The Dungeon.
    Posts
    587

    ° Ignore Dark Mistress
    Hmm it was a interesting read, but I am not sure I understand things any better than I did before I read it.
    Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

    Benjamin Franklin

  3. #3
    Registered User
    Magsman (Lvl 14)



    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Brooklyn
    Posts
    2,486

    ° Ignore Minigiant
    My inference is:

    The Adventure day is worth X amount of XP with can be broken into any number of segments. Each class feature with be given an XP value as well equal to the amount of XP of obstacles it should get rid off. Each class at each level will be then given a features whose daily usage deals with the expect XP of an adventuring day.

    So a level 1 wizard spell is gets rid of 200 XP of obstacles a day. The recommended XP for an adventuring day is 1000 XP. So a 1st level wizard get 3 1st level spells to deal with about 600 XP and the at wills, theme, and background deals with the other 400 XP.
    My beard is hairy.

  4. #4
    Registered User
    The Great Druid (Lvl 17)



    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,419
    Cortex+ZEITGEISTWotBSI Defended The Walls!

    ° Ignore Neonchameleon
    My communities:

    Quote Originally Posted by Minigiant View Post
    My inference is:

    The Adventure day is worth X amount of XP with can be broken into any number of segments. Each class feature with be given an XP value as well equal to the amount of XP of obstacles it should get rid off. Each class at each level will be then given a features whose daily usage deals with the expect XP of an adventuring day.

    So a level 1 wizard spell is gets rid of 200 XP of obstacles a day. The recommended XP for an adventuring day is 1000 XP. So a 1st level wizard get 3 1st level spells to deal with about 600 XP and the at wills, theme, and background deals with the other 400 XP.
    If that really is what they are thinking then they are complete morons. One standard tactical measure is the Defeat in Detail - taking the enemy's force in small chunks.

    To outline why it's a stupid idea, imagine there are two forces of warriors. Team A has 4 warriors who move as a single squad. Team B has 10 warriors all spread out.

    All warriors are identical, attack simultaneously, do 1hp worth of damage, and then resolve attacks.

    4 warriors vs 10. Who wins?

    If the defending warriors control who takes the damage in a given fight. Team A's 4 warriors run up to the first enemy, do 4hp worth of damage to him, and take 1hp in reply. First warrior from Team B dead at the loss of 1hp on team A. If team A can spread the damage around equally, they can take 12 hp worth of damage (i.e. 12 enemy warriors) without losing a man.

    If the inflicting warriors get to chose who takes the damage but people don't have to engage, with the best tactics I can work out, the 4 warriors take down 9.5 enemy warriors before dying. (See below for the workingsv- a warrior in brackets isn't fighting that round.)

    Spoiler:
    Enemy 1
    4,4,4,3 vs X

    Enemy 2
    4,4,4,2vs X

    Enemy 3
    4,4,4,1vs X

    Enemy 4
    4,4,4,Xvs X

    Enemy 5
    4,4,3vs 2
    4,4,2vs X

    Enemy 6
    4,3,(2)vs 2
    4,2,(2)vs X

    Enemy 7
    3,(2),(2) vs 3
    3,2,1 vs X

    Enemy 8
    2,(2),(1) vs 3
    2,2,X vs X

    Enemy 9
    2,1 vs 2
    2,X vs X

    Enemy 10 - obvious. The 10th ends up on 2 wounds.




    It's even worse if the four are allowed to withdraw, rest up, and fight another day - they don't fight the battle against enemy four, and can finesse enemy eight by the almost healthy 3 attacking, then being reinforced by the two, then withdrawing the damaged one to finish off. So it's a crushing 7:0 victory (with four guys surviving on one health vs three on full).

    Defeat in detail: one of the oldest and most effective tactics. And one that would be completely ignored by this method.

  5. #5
    Registered User
    Guide (Lvl 11)

    Chris_Nightwing's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Basel, Switzerland
    Posts
    1,457

    ° Ignore Chris_Nightwing
    Quote Originally Posted by Neonchameleon View Post
    If that really is what they are thinking then they are complete morons. One standard tactical measure is the Defeat in Detail - taking the enemy's force in small chunks.

    To outline why it's a stupid idea, imagine there are two forces of warriors. Team A has 4 warriors who move as a single squad. Team B has 10 warriors all spread out.
    I found it a little difficult to follow your example, but I don't quite see how it's relevant? A team of 4 who get to attack 1 guy at a time will obviously be superior. A Fighter in a doorway can probably be more effective than if the party faced all the enemies at once.
    Everyone is weird, but those who are weird in the same way call themselves normal.

  6. #6
    Registered User
    The Great Druid (Lvl 17)



    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    4,419
    Cortex+ZEITGEISTWotBSI Defended The Walls!

    ° Ignore Neonchameleon
    My communities:

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_Nightwing View Post
    I found it a little difficult to follow your example, but I don't quite see how it's relevant? A team of 4 who get to attack 1 guy at a time will obviously be superior. A Fighter in a doorway can probably be more effective than if the party faced all the enemies at once.
    Yes. They will obviously be superior. That is the point. The understanding some people have is that WotC is suggesting an XP total for the day. Which means that according to the formula, 10 orcs in one mob will be treated as being as hard as 10 orcs one at a time and DMs are encouraged to treat them as wholly equivalent. This is ridiculous.

  7. #7
    I fell asleep reading that. It was like listening to a politician speak to a reporter about policy i.e. give the most neutral, non specific answer you possibly can.

    Did absolutely nothing to raise nor lower my expectations of 5e.

  8. #8
    Registered User
    Grandfather of Assassins (Lvl 19)

    FireLance's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    8,155
    Blog Entries
    232
    I Defended The Walls!

    ° Ignore FireLance
    My communities:

    Seems fairly simple to me. An adventuring day is defined in terms of XP (as a proxy for the number and danger of the challenges encountered) instead of time.

    So, if the "adventuring day" for a party of 1st-level PCs is 1000 XP, a DM who wants to enable his PCs to complete the adventure before taking a long rest would put no more than 1000 XP worth of monsters, traps and other challenges in the adventure.

    If the DM starts by designing the adventure instead, the total number of XP would give an indication of how many long rests the PCs will likely need to take before completing the adventure. For example, the PCs will need to take one long rest in the middle of an adventure with 2000 XP.

    It's basically replacing an encounter XP budget with an adventuring day XP budget.

    However, this does not shed any light on how the DM can encourage the PCs to press on if they decide to use all their daily abilities early in the adventuring day before earning their XP "quota" for the day (the "15-minute workday" problem), apart from the obvious solution of having only a single encounter that uses up the entire XP budget for the adventuring day.

    And I'm sure that people who don't like the system will uncharitably misconstrue it as one in which the PCs stop adventuring and rest once they have hit their XP "quota" for the adventuring day regardless of the state of their daily resources at that point.

  9. #9
    Registered User
    Grandmaster of Flowers (Lvl 18)

    Dice4Hire's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Nagoya, Japan
    Posts
    5,130
    I Defended The Walls!

    ° Ignore Dice4Hire
    I am still unsure that the 15 minute adventuring day is something that needs to be solved in the rulebook. I think at the table is a better place to solve it.

  10. #10
    The Guvnor
    Orcus on an Off-Day (Lvl 22)

    Morrus's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    26,629
    Blog Entries
    4
    13th AgeSupermanCircvs MaximvsENniesPathfinderZEITGEISTDoctor Who

    ° Ignore Morrus
    My communities:

    Quote Originally Posted by Dice4Hire View Post
    I am still unsure that the 15 minute adventuring day is something that needs to be solved in the rulebook. I think at the table is a better place to solve it.
    D&D rulebooks aren't written for those grizzled DM's with long beards who recognise that issue and know how to solve it. They're written for new D&D players who are learning how to DM.

    Let's not make the mistake of equating "I personally do not have that issue" with "nobody in the world has that issue". 25 years ago, I had some pretty frickin' dire D&D games. I wish I hadn't grown 25 years older in the meantime, but it's not the fault of the 13 yr old kids picking up a D&D rulebook today.

+ Log in or register to post
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •