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Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 07:57 PM #11
The Grand Druid (Lvl 20)
I share B.T.'s dislike of previous edition swarm rules, especially 4E. They never really feel like swarms to me; they just feel like singular monsters, sacks of hit points to be beaten down like anything else.
That said, a swarm of 20 singular rats is not something I have any interest in running.
I would prefer to see a swarm treated as an environmental hazard rather than a monster. It doesn't have hit points. Instead, it has squares. Effects that deal area damage above some damage threshold can destroy the squares they target. Non-area attacks have a much higher damage threshold, or perhaps have no effect at all.
Of course, the challenge with this approach would be making it so that swarms are not just another "casters rule, non-casters drool" gotcha.
There is no fluff. There is no crunch. There are only rules of varying precision.
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Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 08:00 PM #12
Spellbinder (Lvl 16)
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 08:12 PM #13
Magsman (Lvl 14)
WotBS: Adrana's Diary
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Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 08:46 PM #14
Thaumaturgist (Lvl 9)
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 08:52 PM #15
Enchanter (Lvl 12)
... Are 11 rats okay?
"A rock on a stick has a 5' reach unless otherwise specified."
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 08:57 PM #16
Thaumaturgist (Lvl 9)
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 09:16 PM #17
Please no swarm rules.
The previous swarm rules were all completely silly as the swarm of creatures always had completely different abilities as the creatures had when faced alone.
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 09:27 PM #18
Waghalter (Lvl 7)
A swarm in real life has very different traits to the individual creatures that it consists of (Edit: before we get dragged into "realism", I'm talking about traits such as the area it might threaten, the volume it contains, how it moves, how dangerous it is). And ask any physicist or chemist about aggregate materials!
"Please no swarm rules." seems like an odd request to me - are you concerned about things in the rulebook that you won't use, to the extent you want them blocked? Seriously, a set of rules for swarms won't be more than a page, which you can safely ignore . . .
Swarms of creatures aren't a necessity in a fantasy game world. But a bit of variety in the types of enemy is just fine by me.
Last edited by slobo777; Wednesday, 26th September, 2012 at 09:32 PM.
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 10:21 PM #19
Spellbinder (Lvl 16)
Wednesday, 26th September, 2012, 11:02 PM #20
Guide (Lvl 11)
Hrmmm...this has to be some kind Rorschach test for the effect of looking at a singular token on a grid versus multiple tokens (I can't imagine that swarm rules would matter one way or another in TotM play as there is no sensory input outside of the description of the fiction).
- Do you want to have a token in each of 4 squares adjacent to you representing 4 tiny creatures in each square and adjudicate their collective impact as individual attack rolls (and the attacks against them one by one)?
- Do you want to have a 2 * 2 token representing 16 (or more) or more tiny creatures as a cohesive (but incoherent) swarm and adjudicate their collective impact as a collective, single attack roll + aura effect (and the attacks against them as a single attack roll with special rules)?
This seems as thought it has to be some kind of grid:token sensory input over-riding the fiction, assuming there is a depiction by the DM (because if not, then there is your answer...I'll assume that there is because you would have thought of that simple answer and therefore wouldn't have composed this thread), kind of deal as TotM is neutral.
Or maybe its the word "swarm." You could try a test. Use the 2 * 2 token, and the corresponding swarm rules, and take a black felt-tip marker and write NOT A SWARM on the token. See if that works for you or if the NOT A SWARM swarm of rats still feels like a bag of HPs.
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