Paleo/Primal/Ancestral/Low-Carb Dietary Lifestyles

Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator
Staff member
Supporter
For example, Newton's Laws are correct, to first approximation. Einstein gives us correction.

Yep.

From what I understand, the new research is suggesting something along the lines of "fat calories in food are more likely to be converted to body fat than other kinds of cells if and only if the body is in a metabolic state in which it is seeking to create fat." And this is so because it is more efficient to do so.

Also, of course, calories from certain simple sugars are going to be used more efficiently than others because they are already in a state that the body can use for fuel without processing.
 

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Storminator

First Post
I started low carb diet on September 1st. So far, I've lost 15 pounds, and today was the first day I've actually been hungry on the diet. I was very surprised to feel hungry, then I noticed it was 1:30 and I usually have lunch at noon. :D

I'm pretty sure I haven't reduced calories very significantly, and certainly not as much as when I did actual calorie restriction diets. And I certainly feel vastly better.

That said, there's a proselytizing effect a successful diet has that can be a bit annoying. ;)

PS
 

Storminator

First Post
That's bold indeed. Nutritionists across the planet would be excited to discuss with you this notion of calories being "tragically misapplied nutritional science".
I'd be amazed if even the authors of these books make that claim about the notion of calorie intake and expenditure.

Actually, Taubes, mentioned above devotes chapters of his book to it.

PS
 

Weregrognard

First Post
Man! I should have just started a thread about D&D editions :p

Umbran, I don't know if you're playing Devil's Advocate, or concerned skeptic, but I admit I am not prepared to intelligently debate my dietary choices here, nor is it what I set out to do in this thread. I’m already at a disadvantage because the current paradigm on obesity and health puts the burden of proof on me, but nobody questions mainstream hypotheses, even if they are flawed. If you need more details, feel free to research all this, but I warn you that you'll see "just how deep the rabbit hole goes..." :cool:

The science (and paradigm) IS changing, but it will take a long time. See things the Ancestral Health Symposium recently at Harvard. It's maddening to see new studies in the mainstream that dance around potential answers, but ultimately come to flawed conclusions based on the same flawed hypotheses. Political and market forces that seek to maintain the status quo (food industry, Big Pharma, Big Agra, etc.) are major hurdles to this. No tin-foil conspiracy here, just capitalism.

And no, calorie restriction is not the simplest way to lose weight. "Eat less, move more" is only simple for those whose metabolisms are self-regulated due to either lifetime healthy habits, or more likely, winning the genetic lottery. Ask anyone who's tried depriving themselves of food when hungry, that is what "calories-in-calories-out" is - starvation. Remember, anorexics and bulimics lose weight too, but would you consider them healthy? When you're eating mostly carbohydrate from (whole) grains and sugar (even from otherwise healthy fruit), and skimp on animal protein and fat (because it's eevil, and Jillian Michaels would be angry with you), you never reach any form of real satiety (or balanced nutrition, for that matter), thus feeling hungry every 2-3 hours. Eventually, your will breaks and you wake up from a food coma with several pizza boxes and marinara sauce on your face :uhoh:

You know what is simple? Being able to go to work with just a cup of coffee in the morning and not being actually hungry until lunch time because you're successfully regulating your own metabolism. Then, being able to go to parkour or martial arts lessons in the afternoon without a sugar-laden, healthy "energy” bar because your body is working on its own fat stores (as opposed to sugar). Being able to eat delicious, eevil food afterwards (tell me a rack of ribs and sweet potatoes slathered in real butter aren’t deliciously eevil), and not only NOT gain weight, but have to go to the store that weekend to get new work clothes because you’re starting to look like a kid wearing his dad’s clothes.

That's what's happening to me. Now, in the interest of full disclosure, I've never been obese, but definitely overweight off and on since just after high school, even when I was in the military. This isn't the first time I've tried losing weight but it's the first time I seem to be losing it consistently, seemingly without effort (or feeling deprived), and in a healthy way (more on that after blood work from my recent physical comes back). I've been doing this for (give or take) a year.

This isn't "secret knowledge". There's nothing secret about eating the kinds of foods we would eat in the wild (as animal species ourselves) instead of manufactured foods, which have quantifiable negative effects on our bodies.

I honestly think that quite a few decades from now, hopefully within my lifetime, we'll be seeing things like "calories-in-calories-out", low-fat, whole-grain foods, MyPlate, and other such so-called “healthy” recommendations go the way of old ads with 3/5 doctors recommending Winston cigarettes for health.
 
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Quickleaf

Legend
Yep.

From what I understand, the new research is suggesting something along the lines of "fat calories in food are more likely to be converted to body fat than other kinds of cells if and only if the body is in a metabolic state in which it is seeking to create fat." And this is so because it is more efficient to do so.

Also, of course, calories from certain simple sugars are going to be used more efficiently than others because they are already in a state that the body can use for fuel without processing.
That's a pretty good summation of the research so far. I learned that the author recently co-founded a non-profit to do some more meaty research, so it'll be interesting once that gets going.

Oh and "fry curious"!! I'd +1 you if I hadn't done so too recently :)

Actually, Taubes, mentioned above devotes chapters of his book to it.

PS
There's quite a bit of history involved, but the short version is WWII took a great toll on the European scientific community (where Taubes' argument proto-originated), and at the same time a moralistic streak (I guess you could call it) in a few American doctors was followed by the exercise industry boom. Since then it's basically become accepted wisdom...something like the court cases upholding the rights of corporations as individuals which rely on precedent which rely on precedent, going all the way back to some very faulty research coupled with profit-driven "nutrition experts".

Anyhow, I realize how controversial this is and that nutrition can be a bit like religion or politics. My horse in this race isn't to win anyone else over. Heck, I dont even have a comprehensive answer yet. It has been to improve my health and educate myself, and inspire others to question.

[sblock=My personal health story]When I was on some hard antidepressant meds three years back (thankfully no more), they caused a metabolic reaction where I gained 50 pounds, going from 190 to 240. Some of the weight was water retention, yes, but most of it was fat. While I had low periods of lethargy and overeating, I had more periods of a disciplined exercise regimen and healthy eating (my usual baseline). Of course my doc told me to lose the weight I should eat "right" and exercise more. I grew up that way, and for me those words were pretty much a mantra, so that's what I did.

But the weight was persistent, and while I lost 10 pounds water weight pretty swiftly once I got off those meds, the rest hung around like an unwanted in-law. As I tracked myself with a biweekly spreadsheet and measured portions I realized that my weight would sometimes stay the same after several days of vigorous exercise and normal eating. According to calories in/calories out that made no sense.

My suspicion was that in recovery I would have high carbohydrate, high glycemic index food and drink (rice, noodles, Gatorade, juice, ice cream) and this somehow induced a state where my body sought to create fat. My friends suggested this or that diet, but I know diets have notoriously poor success ratios and people ping-pong their weight. Instead I started researching "metabolic syndrome" and happened upon Taubes books, which have been a great springboard for my own inquiry and experimentation.

Since implementing the suggestions about diet modification he gives, along with a battery of nutritional supplements from my own research, combined with sufficient sleep, and no change to my normal exercise regimen, I've been losing 1.5 pounds a week for the past 7 weeks, going from 240 to 230. But the biggest change I've noticed is that I have fewer moments of extreme lethargy or sudden urges to overconsume food. It feels like I'm slowly but steadily getting the "old me" back.

-Aaron[/sblock]
 
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Elf Witch

First Post
My son is on a primal diet and it has done wonders for his diabetes. I use a low carb diet to control my diabetes.

For people with no health issues then calories in and calories out is kind of true but for people with diabetes or other health issues it certainly is not true.

Eating 1000 calories of protein for example will have a different effect than eating 1000 calories of brown rice.
 

Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator
Staff member
Supporter
...because too many starches & sugars wreak havoc in the body of someone with diabetes. That would be my Mom.

I have to deal with a few different dietary issues as the main cook in the family.

My main dietary issues are a corn allergy, a chocolate allergy and my sodium intake- I'm the most sodium dependent hypertensive my previous doctor had ever seen in his 40+ year practice. Even on a technically low-sodium diet, my BP hit an astounding (and asymptomatic) 220/201. Most people who hit numbers like that wind up in the hospital...or worse. He was thinking that if it wasn't sodium, then I must have something super serious, like an undetected micro-tumor in my head.

After 2 weeks on an ultra-low sodium diet coupled with a powerful diuretic, I had dropped to 150/90 and dropped 20lbs of weight- pure water weight. Currently, I'm at 129/85.

(Still, losing more weight would help even more, so I'm getting more rigorous about my portion control.)
 


Karak

First Post
Edited for clarify around nutritional guidelines.

I have been low carb since 1994. The year after I graduated. Back then it was Atkins and I have, at times, gone between the different versions.

I was 297 when I started, my lowest weight was 187 and I am 203 now standing at 6 foot 2. Personally I could never go back. Though at times I have strayed, due to celebrations and so forth, and also 1 year where I was only training students in martial arts and not working a normal 9-5 job, I have stayed on it consistently. I feel amazing on low carb and have always felt fairly poorly on what nutritional guidelines call a normal amount of carbs these days. It is just not for me.

I am also fairly high energy and high output but don't seem to have any real issues with the lower carbs. I lift weights daily, teach martial arts 3-4 times a week, run, and do some various other physical things and luckily have never really had any issues from low carb as of yet.

I will say that one thing I am not totally happy with is the lower need for sleep. A lot of low carbers talk about it and I do get hit with that harder than most.
 
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