Ioun Torches, spell level, etc.

GlassEye · Oct 4, 2012

Ioun torches are created by casting Continual Flames upon a burned out ioun stone. The question is what is the level of that continual flame spell? Is it considered 2nd level (cast by a wizard, sorcerer, or cleric using the Day subdomain spell) or 3rd level (cast by a regular cleric, oracle, or inquisitor)? It matters when the stone interacts with a darkness spell; one would be suppressed, the other would not.

And what should I do as a DM where I have this interaction going on right now? Going off the assumption that most magic items are made by wizards I've ruled they are functionally wizard spells and at 2nd spell level.

Maybe we could have some sort of distinction between the wizard item and the clerical item. I dunno, something like the Eye of Hinotheus/Helerion/other Sun/Light god with a slight bump to cost to reflect its greater power and usefulness?

Systole · Oct 4, 2012

Ioun torches cost 75gp. A dull grey ioun stone is 25gp, and the cost of casting a Continual Light on it is spell level x caster level x 10gp. So if a wizard did it, the price should be 25 + 2x3x10 = 85gp. If a cleric did it, it should be 25 + 3x5x10 = 175gp.

Based on that, I think it's pretty clear that ioun torches are wizard-made, and apparently even discounted slightly because there are a lot of starving apprentice wizards working in sweatshops just knocking that damn things out 14 hours a day. If a character wants a cleric made one, it's a specialty item that costs the full 175gp. And no discounts on specialty items.

Unless otherwise noted, magic items are always made at the minimum caster level.

Scott DeWar · Oct 5, 2012

if in doubt, this shows it as a caster level of 12.

MalusNecessarius · Oct 5, 2012

I think the entry for the item is just bad. 75 gold is what it would cost a caster to grab a dull ioun stone (25gp) and the material component for continual flame (50gp). By the rules laid out in the srd, a wizard casting the spell on the stone would be asking about 40gp if you provided the 75g worth of ingredients, for a total of 115g.

It seems actually crafting it requires the "craft wondrous item" feat and a caster level of 12, and makes it so the flame can only be suppressed, not dispelled. To craft it a caster would still need to use the material component of the spell, and still need the stone.

For all that extra effort and the one extra feature the crafter decides to then sell the thing at 40 gp cheaper than the easier method of making it. I'd say maybe some academy has students make it as practice and sell them off at cost... but I don't see a level 12 wizard being a student. Maybe some cleric of a god with light domain passing them around as some kind of good deed?

Systole · Oct 5, 2012

MN nailed it on the material cost. I missed that.

MalusNecessarius · Oct 5, 2012

Most characters I play, I try to have the spell cast on some piece of clothing or jewelry as soon as possible. No hand needed to hold a torch, no weight, and 10g cheaper.

jkason · Oct 5, 2012

I think we can probably just fall back on the same rule we use for Scrolls, Potions, and Wands on the wiki:

Lowest level of (Cleric, Druid, Wizard), or if not in there, lowest level of (the rest of them). And the second rule is more useful. Don't bother with arcane or divine versions, it just works.

There's a longer version up there quoting the PFS rule we used as a template, but the essence of the ruling is nice and simple, and in this case results in ioun torch = wizard-made since there's a difference between the two.