D&D 3E/3.5 Multiple attacks with a 2-handed weapon? 3 or 3.5

magnusmalkus · Oct 8, 2012

Hobo said:
These are antagonists that you intend to put against the PCs as a DM, right? Am I getting the context right here?

If so, why does it matter? If you want them to have two attacks per round, just say that they have two attacks per round.

D&D is a special kind of a hobby with me.

I've always looked at character and NPC builds as if they were ships in a bottle. They're fun to create and it's fun to perfect them so 'they look good on display' (meaning they play well.)

One of my favorite past times has been building archtype monsters... ones that fill a very specific niche.

magnusmalkus · Oct 8, 2012

When I saw the specifics on the Flindbar, I was going to make this build into a disarmer instead of a sunderer... but for flavor, I imagine gnolls favoring sundering to disarming... sundering is just more brutal, and brutal is the defining character of a gnoll.

But they're still slavers... and I need to understand the rules around nets. And what goes better with netted slaves than whipping! And I noticed that whips are good for disarming too... soooo

Anyone care to help me build a net and whip specialist?

Throwing rules are a bit shaky with me. Is there any way feat or special ability-wise where we can improve a characters ability with nets? I can think of a few basic, core feats and abilities that would help improve disarming ... Weapon focus: whip + improved disarm... but where else to go with that... Saps... sneaking up and taking by surprise... somehow improve the number of move equivalent actions per round to quickly re-fold the net...

Jackinthegreen · Oct 8, 2012

magnusmalkus said:
I'm not familiar with spiked armor rules.

I need to be able to sunder with the second attack. Can you used improved sunder with a spiked armor attack?

Spiked armor is a light weapon, and to get the second attack you'd need to use two-weapon fighting rules, which will further murder your chances at being an effective sunderer.

You could give them all a barbarian level and the Whirling Frenzy rage variant.

If you really want to be mean you could also use the Lion Totem variant in Complete Champion, which grants a full attack on a charge.

As far as the weapons are concerned, you can just refluff the greatswords a little to be more curved. It's not like you have to be held to the "standard" version of the weapon.

Wyvernhand · Oct 8, 2012

Nets are pretty simple. You throw a net just like you would throw a dagger or club. Proficiency is encouraged, but not required (-4 to hit). If you hit the foes touch AC, they gain the entangled condition, per the PHB. The rest of the rules are right there in the weapon description of the PHB. Getting out is done with a burst check, escape artist, or cutting your way out. Holding onto the end of the rope allows you to drag a foe, or at least keep then from hobbling away with your net, with opposed strength checks governing the success of the action. Being entangled gives a -2 penalty on attack rolls, meaning that netted foes are more likely to fail opposed sunder checks. Send your gnolls in pairs. One has a net, the other has a sundering weapon.

Whips in 3.5 are pretty worthless for anything other than tripping or disarming. They can't do damage to foes with decent armor, so they are only really good for beating up existing slaves rather than taking new ones. The best way to take a slave is simply to knock it out. Non-lethal damage stacks up and brings foes down just the same as lethal. One good non-lethal shot on top of a few lethal hits is just as likely to knock a foe out as the same amount of non-lethal hits barring super high damage attacks or lucky crits.

Jackinthegreen · Oct 8, 2012

If you're going for a thrower, the Brutal Throw feat is probably a good idea in this scenario.

Razjah · Oct 8, 2012

If this is for a specific region, could you make a difficult to acquire feat? For example, make it racial with pre-reqs being power attack, improved sunder, and weapon focus-falchion (or whatever weapon you want). This would let you get the extra attacks (possible with a penalty), and if you have scaled versions of the Smasher Gnolls, the weak guys don't have it.

I think something like this would be a good way to handle this, your gnolls could advance through the ranks of their organizations and gain the feats as they go. Recruits would have power attack, initiates have power attack and improved sunder, adepts have power attack, improved sunder, and weapon focus. Then the Smashers have the new feat and an awesome ability to bust up gear in combat.

At least, this is how I would handle this.

Greenfield · Oct 9, 2012

I know I'm a latecomer to this conversation, and I'm a little brain burned, but can someone point me to a place in the rules where is says people using two handed weapons don't get multiple attacks?

That's the founding premise in the OP, and I'm unfamiliar with it. Think of me the old beggar on the corner: "Clues for the clueless?"

Desdichado · Oct 9, 2012

magnusmalkus said:
D&D is a special kind of a hobby with me.

I've always looked at character and NPC builds as if they were ships in a bottle. They're fun to create and it's fun to perfect them so 'they look good on display' (meaning they play well.)

One of my favorite past times has been building archtype monsters... ones that fill a very specific niche.

Huh. That's pretty much the exact opposite of how I play. But... that's pretty cool.

Jackinthegreen · Oct 9, 2012

Greenfield said:
I know I'm a latecomer to this conversation, and I'm a little brain burned, but can someone point me to a place in the rules where is says people using two handed weapons don't get multiple attacks?

That's the founding premise in the OP, and I'm unfamiliar with it. Think of me the old beggar on the corner: "Clues for the clueless?"

You are misreading it. He specifically mentions he doesn't want the second attack to come from BAB, which means he's familiar with iterative attack rules.

However, one of my suggestions would be to go against that: Give the gnolls levels in the warrior NPC class. That way they can get the second attack from BAB, but their actual CR, by the DMG way of calculating it with NPC class levels, should be in line with the power level implied in the OP. They'll also have a bit less HP than if they went into fighter (warrior's d8 vs fighter's d10), so that could play out decently.

magnusmalkus · Oct 9, 2012

Jackinthegreen said:
You could give them all a barbarian level and the Whirling Frenzy rage variant.

If you really want to be mean you could also use the Lion Totem variant in Complete Champion, which grants a full attack on a charge.

As far as the weapons are concerned, you can just refluff the greatswords a little to be more curved. It's not like you have to be held to the "standard" version of the weapon.

These are great suggestions and round out the concept nicely. Thanks!