Comprehending languages and knowing which languages they are

Ranes

Adventurer

• Jun 17, 2013

• #1

Let's say the party finds a note written in Abyssal. None of the party knows the language but - no problem - somebody casts comprehend languages and the note can be read.

The question is: does the party know the language is Abyssal? From a strict reading of the spell description, the answer has to be that they do not.

Most of the time, you don't need to know the identity of the language; you just need to understand the contents of the message. But knowing the language it's written in could prove useful.

You could go around showing the note to sages, mages and clerics and asking them if they recognise it. But that might not be a good idea for any number of reasons.

How do you handle this issue?

Thanks.

 

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Ahnehnois

First Post

• Jun 17, 2013

• #2

I'd call it a Knowledge (Planes) or Decipher Script check, doable untrained. DC depends on your campaign world, I'd say a DC 5 gets you some idea that it's probably an evil language (that would likely be very obvious; Tolkien-style scripts you can tell by looking at them) and a DC 10 gets you the alphabet (Infernal, by the book) and implicitly tells you it's an extraplanar language, while 15 gets you the exact language. Scale that up or down depending on how much well-known this type of information would be in the context of the PCs' environment.

 

Alzrius

The EN World kitten

• Jun 17, 2013

• #3

While we're on the subject, if you used one language's alphabet to write words that were phonetically spelling out writing in another language, would comprehend languages (or any similar type of magic) translate that?

For example, if I were to write Ore wa genki da, I'm using English letters to write a Japanese sentence - would the spell translate that (and would it make a difference if the caster didn't speak either language already)?

 

Ranes

Adventurer

• Jun 17, 2013

• #4

Knowledge skills are probably the best way forward, short of someone literate in the language confirming it. It also leaves open the possibility of reaching the wrong conclusion with absolute conviction that you've arrived at the correct one.

That'll do nicely.

Thanks.

 

Ranes

Adventurer

• Jun 17, 2013

• #5

Alzrius said:

While we're on the subject, if you used one language's alphabet to write words that were phonetically spelling out writing in another language, would comprehend languages (or any similar type of magic) translate that?

For example, if I were to write Ore wa genki da, I'm using English letters to write a Japanese sentence - would the spell translate that (and would it make a difference if the caster didn't speak either language already)?

Click to expand...

You're talking about transliteration and you raise a very good question. My gut instinct would be to say that cl doesn't work unless the language in question commonly gets written in the different alphabet or the reader speaks the words aloud. Assuming the phonetics are close enough, the spell should work in the latter case, because it normally does work on the spoken word.

 

Dandu

First Post

• Jun 17, 2013

• #6

For example, if I were to write Ore wa genki da, I'm using English letters to write a Japanese sentence - would the spell translate that (and would it make a difference if the caster didn't speak either language already)?

Click to expand...

It's gibberish without a means of denoting intonation.

 

Ranes

Adventurer

• Jun 17, 2013

• #7

That's true for languages that have a tonal component but not all do. Good point though.

 

Alzrius

The EN World kitten

• Jun 17, 2013

• #8

Dandu said:

It's gibberish without a means of denoting intonation.

Click to expand...

Ranes said:

That's true for languages that have a tonal component but not all do. Good point though.

Click to expand...

It's not true in this case, however, since Japanese doesn't have a tonal component to it.

 

Ranes

Adventurer

• Jun 17, 2013

• #9

I wasn't sure about that. I suppose the question becomes, does Abyssal, Draconic, Celestial, et al?

 

M

Michael Silverbane

Adventurer

• Jun 17, 2013

• #10

On the original question, I would probably assume that the characters can know what language the script is in.

On the question of CL and transliterated info, I'd allow it.

If, for some reason, I wanted comprehend languages not to work, I'd remove it from the game's spell list.