Can you separate an author from his or her work?

Elf Witch · Aug 2, 2014

The allegations coming out from Marion Zimmer Bradly's children of physical and sexual abuse at the hands of their mother has made me think about this. I am fan of her work though I didn't like her personally I had met her and she rubbed me the wrong way. But I was able to separate that from her work and still buy her books. But this I am not sure about. I don't know if I can ever read her again and enjoy the books. I know many fans are actually getting rid of her books off their shelves. I share my library with my roommate of 35 years and after talking about it she wants to keep them because she can separate the person from the fiction. I am fine with that. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer on this.

MZB is dead she can't profit from the sales of her books and the estate is donating all sales of her ebooks to charity as are some writers who were published in her many anthologies.

I can say if she was alive there would be no way I would feel right putting money into her pocket.

I was wondering how other people feel about things like this? Not just about authors but anyone who creates art, music, literature, film?

I would prefer if we avoid the discussion of is the allegations true I don't think this is the place to debate things like that and that is not the purpose of this thread.

delericho · Aug 2, 2014

Generally, yes, I consider the work differently from the artist. That said, there are limits - it's a big difference between reading a book by someone I disagree with politically, or one who has some unsavory opinions, versus one who is guilty of serious crimes.

That said, I do consider that 'guilty' to be important - a person who is alleged to have done something, but not yet found guilty of that thing is (for me) different from one who has actually done those things. That is, Michael Jackson was always in a different category from Gary Glitter.

(And where the person accused of wrongdoing, that's something else again, since on the one hand there's no real reason for those making the allegations to lie, but on the other there's no opportunity for the accused to defend themselves.)

I don't have any MZR books (I think). If I did, I wouldn't get rid of them. But neither am I likely to pick up anything by her any time soon.

Janx · Aug 2, 2014

interesting question.

One factor is "are the allegations true"

If the allegations are just 'alleged' and not pretty well proven as fact, we're still in a grey area as to whether the author is a bad person.

second factor is how bad was the crime?

I would assume there are some crimes for which a person must be expunged from history. All of their works deleted, other than record of their wrong-doing. If Plato was a serial rapist, I'd delete The Republic in a heartbeat.

Hitler for instance, deserves to have every copy of Mein Camf destroyed.

I say that as a guy who doesn't normally like to destroy data.

Dannyalcatraz · Aug 3, 2014

Janx said:
interesting question.

One factor is "are the allegations true"

If the allegations are just 'alleged' and not pretty well proven as fact, we're still in a grey area as to whether the author is a bad person.

second factor is how bad was the crime?

I would assume there are some crimes for which a person must be expunged from history. All of their works deleted, other than record of their wrong-doing. If Plato was a serial rapist, I'd delete The Republic in a heartbeat.

Hitler for instance, deserves to have every copy of Mein Camf destroyed.

I say that as a guy who doesn't normally like to destroy data.

Mein Kampf needs to be preserved, if for no other reason than as partial proof of the horrors committed by its writer; as evidence of what drove him.

That way, it serves as a warning that will let us recognize those signs in others.

Morrus · Aug 3, 2014

Yeah. MK doesn't exactly benefit Hitler. He's dead. But it teaches us things about how evil like that rises. We need to know this stuff.

Elf Witch · Aug 3, 2014

Janx I can understand the desire to wipe someone who is so evil from the face of the earth. But I also question if by doing so if you are preventing giving the tools for future generations to recognize evil.

I am also not sure if wiping out something that can benefit humanity just because it was created by an evil person is the right thing to do. For example I was watching an episode of Voyager where B'lanna was infected and was going to die the doctor created a hologram of an expert who came up with a treatment that was based on experimentation on the people of Bajor. The debate was was it immoral to use this knowledge to save a life. Some including B'lanna felt yes others felt no.

If a scientist comes up with a cure for cancer and we find out that he is an evil SOB who used innocent people who suffered and died do we say no the cure is tainted and it is unethical to use? I don't know if there is a right answer. On one hand you are in a way taking advantage of the suffering and in a way encouraging unethical scientist to do it again. On the other hand you are saving millions of lives and it could be argued that at least it gave some meaning to the death and the suffering.

Dannyalcatraz · Aug 3, 2014

I have had occasion to ponder that cure for cancer scenario at length.

My take: it is perfectly reasonable and ethical to use the cure- if confirmed as genuine- and condemn the methodology used to make the discovery. It is highly unlikely that the breakthrough occurred SOLELY because the researcher abandoned the practice of ethical research. And in a sense, using such a breakthrough at least means that the victims of the unethical researchers did not suffer in vain.

FWIW, we're seeing a bit of this dilemma in the current Ebola outbreak. There are about 4-5 possible vaccines/cures that have been worked on for years, but are not approved as yet. The combination of the rarity of Ebola, the particulars of the outbreaks, and the ethical restraints preventing deliberate infection to test antiviral medications have meant no drug has gone through a full set of clinical trials.

Kramodlog · Aug 3, 2014

Elf Witch said:
The allegations coming out from Marion Zimmer Bradly's children of physical and sexual abuse at the hands of their mother has made me think about this. I am fan of her work though I didn't like her personally I had met her and she rubbed me the wrong way. But I was able to separate that from her work and still buy her books. But this I am not sure about. I don't know if I can ever read her again and enjoy the books. I know many fans are actually getting rid of her books off their shelves. I share my library with my roommate of 35 years and after talking about it she wants to keep them because she can separate the person from the fiction. I am fine with that. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer on this.

MZB is dead she can't profit from the sales of her books and the estate is donating all sales of her ebooks to charity as are some writers who were published in her many anthologies.

I can say if she was alive there would be no way I would feel right putting money into her pocket.

I was wondering how other people feel about things like this? Not just about authors but anyone who creates art, music, literature, film?

I would prefer if we avoid the discussion of is the allegations true I don't think this is the place to debate things like that and that is not the purpose of this thread.

You've had a roommate for 35 years!?

Elf Witch · Aug 3, 2014

goldomark said:
You've had a roommate for 35 years!?

Yes my best friend and I found that we live well together and after my divorce we became roommates and she helped me raise my son. When I became disabled she helped me keep a roof over my head. I never had any desire after awhile to remarry and she has never wanted to marry now as we slide closer to 60 we find that this living arrangement suits us very well.

I have always found it amusing some people's reaction to two straight woman living together so long. It is like they are not comfertable without being able to put some kind of label on it.

Kramodlog · Aug 3, 2014

Elf Witch said:
Yes my best friend and I found that we live well together and after my divorce we became roommates and she helped me raise my son. When I became disabled she helped me keep a roof over my head. I never had any desire after awhile to remarry and she has never wanted to marry now as we slide closer to 60 we find that this living arrangement suits us very well.

I have always found it amusing some people's reaction to two straight woman living together so long. It is like they are not comfertable without being able to put some kind of label on it.

I did not know you were a woman. All I thought was that you were a very old teenager.

Can you separate an author from his or her work?

Elf Witch

First Post

delericho

Legend

Janx

Hero

Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator

Morrus

Well, that was fun

Elf Witch

First Post

Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel

Elf Witch

First Post

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel

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