GDQ1-7 redux help!

Hello All,

I realize that this may not get too many hits since this is a small forum, but I had a question for you all and find this an always-helpful font of ideas:

I'm doing an OSR campaign using 13th age rules, and I would like it to end up using the G and D series modules from 1e. The problem with doing this in 4e/13tha is that giants are mid-to-high paragon/champion opponents, meaning that a party would need to be around 21st/8th level even to get through a revised fire giant module. This leaves few levels to explore the underdark, and totally changes how drow and kyo-toa can be used. So, here were my thoughts:

1) just run G2 and take down all the frost giant levels by 1. This makes the adventure barely suitable for 5th or 6th level PCs (base combat vs two giants = two large 6th level monsters) and means I can get them into the underdark by 6th-7th level.

2) run the underdark modules first. No idea how to get them back to the surface for the giant adventures though; any thoughts?

3) skip the giants and send the PCs straight into the underdark. Add elements of night below and CotSQ to flesh out the adventure.

Would love some advice!

Well, with only a little adjustment in 13A, the following should be possible:

5th: G1 Hill Giant
6th: G2 Frost Giant
7th: G3 Fire Giant
8th-9th: D1-D3
10th: Q

I may not be remembering things correctly, and maybe there's enough in D1-D3 that they're worth breaking out into 3 levels, so you'd pull giants back a further level, but I remember skipping far more encounters in the D series than in the G series.

It's totally fine to declare that giants are less tough in your 13A world. Giants were originally a very trivial opponent, but almost every edition made them scarier.

Keep the giants powerful just warn the party and let them play smart. The Giant modules work very well with a group of PCs taking advantage of their relative small size and sneaking around the place. Encourage them to play it more like Die Hard then a frontal assault. You can also increase the PC power by giving them NPCs and hirelings to help out.

Actually, how big is your party? Remember that champion adventurers can handle threats a level or so higher. 3 large level 6s is a totally dealable encounter for 5 level 5 PCs.

Awesome advice. Thanks guys!

Sadly we are at 4 PCs so I can't go over two giants per "fair" combat. NBD because I'm sure I can tweak the encounters accordingly.

Crothian: My players are going to have to deal with these modules that way regardless. They know that there's no facing some of the major encounters head on (e.g. 20 hill giants?!). It's more the COMPARATIVE encounter difficulty that concerns me. I don't want them going from encounters featuring four 7th-9th-level Large opponents to comparatively wimpy encounters in the Underdark.

keterys: Definitely appreciate your suggestions. Yeah, I think I'll knock the giants down 1 level, play G1 and G2 and then transition into the G3 dungeons, skipping over the fire giants entirely and thus effectively capping the giant encounter levels with Jarl Grungnir (frost giant adventurer, i.e. large 8th level wrecker). This way the (probably 6th level) PCs head into the dungeons (and eventually the Underdark) squaring off against ~7th level foes like drow nobles, illith - er, soul flensers - and similar opponents. I happen to like the D modules largely because of how much I groove on Underdark content in general; the originals are very thin, but the compilation adventure definitely features some juicy ideas.

Luckily, I'm keeping Q1 totally optional (I have a love-hate relationship with this module), and I might run it as a "beyond epic" extra where the PCs start the adventure at 10th level and acquire some experimental abilities as "incremental advancements" while they explore the Demonweb.

In what way, are you thinking, this is an OSR campaign?

I see 13th Age rules...which I am given to understand match 4e pretty closely.

I see talking/worried about matching suitably leveled monsters for "fair" encounters for your # of PCs.

I'm not seeing the OS...or the R.

steeldragons said:

I see 13th Age rules...which I am given to understand match 4e pretty closely.

Click to expand...

Not really, no.

I see talking/worried about matching suitably leveled monsters for "fair" encounters for your # of PCs.

Click to expand...

Eh, that was actually a thing back then as well. You'd figure out roughly how much your party could take on, then plan around it a little bit. At least, as an adventure writer you might. DMs? Expect table variation.

Like, the feast in the Hill Giant steading is way too many monsters to fight at once... but it's only a little crazy in 1st edition. In 2nd edition it's quite a lot more crazy. In 3rd or 13A, even more so. And it's totally possible to string some of the monsters out of it, scout it out, etc. It's not spoonfed to you as a fair encounter, but if you play it smart, then it _is_ fair.

keterys said:

Not really, no.

Click to expand...

*shrug* Ok. So it's more like 3e? Still not OS.

keterys said:

Eh, that was actually a thing back then as well. You'd figure out roughly how much your party could take on, then plan around it a little bit. At least, as an adventure writer you might. DMs? Expect table variation.

Like, the feast in the Hill Giant steading is way too many monsters to fight at once... but it's only a little crazy in 1st edition. In 2nd edition it's quite a lot more crazy. In 3rd or 13A, even more so. And it's totally possible to string some of the monsters out of it, scout it out, etc. It's not spoon fed to you as a fair encounter, but if you play it smart, then it _is_ fair.

Click to expand...

Well yeah. If the players play smart. Not "Here ya go kiddies. Nice bite-sized chunks for you." like some pre-masticated baby bird's food. The players need to work things out, "play it smart", I agree. That is not, for what I would call an OSR game, the DM's job or problem. "From what you can see, you count about 20 Hill Giants in the feast hall" is the DM's job. The player's job? "Figure out how to get through and away from this situation...alive...and, preferably, with at least some of their stuff."

steeldragons said:

In what way, are you thinking, this is an OSR campaign?

I see 13th Age rules...which I am given to understand match 4e pretty closely.

I see talking/worried about matching suitably leveled monsters for "fair" encounters for your # of PCs.

I'm not seeing the OS...or the R.

Click to expand...

No one expects the OSR Inquisition!

Using classic D&D modules is arguably 'old school', but doing it with 13A probably wouldn't meet with the approval of any of the numerous High Anticlerics of the OSR.

steeldragons said:

*shrug* Ok. So it's more like 3e? Still not OS.

Click to expand...

It's a love letter to D&D, with a bunch of other story things in it. It's kinda like 5E; bits from all sorts of editions.

It definitely has 4E elements in it, and 3E elements in it, yes. It was done by the lead designers of both It actually has the most restricted / difficult resurrection mechanics of any of the editions, though, and at high level you need to play smart of just about anything can kill anyone very rapidly. Which in a way might not be terribly OSR, since that tended to be more about lesser damages and steady attrition over the day. Also less so on the "save or die" aspect, though; all kinds of badness can happen, but it tends to take a round to fall unconscious to a spell, so that you have time to react to it.

Anyhow, mishmash of the editions. Totally worth trying. It's probably too new for an OSR purist.