Martial Arts & Weapon Mastery

DammitVictor

Trust the Fungus
Supporter
So, one thing I miss about AD&D and BECMI is the weapon specialization and mastery rules, and from AD&D especially, the martial arts system from Oriental Adventures and Complete Ninja's Handbook. I do not like that unarmed combat and mystical fighting techniques are the sole province of the Monk class. Also, given that feats have been completely reworked from their implementation in 3e and 4e, are optional and compete for precious character-building resources, I do not want this system to be feat-based.

Weapon Mastery is tricky, because most of the advantages of weapon mastery in the systems that featured it are duplicated by Fighter and Champion class features-- bonuses to hit and to damage, extra attacks, increased critical chance and effect. (BECMI had morale effects and weapons-based special effects, too.) Trying to replicate these would generally mean diminishing the Fighter's effectiveness relative to other classes; for instance, compare granting an 11th level Barbarian or Paladin a third attack compared to granting an 11th level Fighter a fourth. Bounded accuracy means that to-hit bonuses are problematic.

So, I'm not sure what weapon mastery would even do in this system. I'm stumped.

On the other side of things, the martial arts rules would basically mean cannibalizing the Monk in bite-size chunks. All of the Monk class features would be on the chopping block, with the Monk's main appeal being the ability to have all of them, and generally more martial arts goodness than the other classes.

So, the general abilities PCs of all classes should be able to obtain from the Monk:
  • The entire Martial Arts class feature, with increased unarmed damage requiring further investment.
  • Ki Pool
  • Flurry of Blows
  • Various Ki Abilities
  • Saving Throw proficiencies?
  • Resistances and Immunities

It occurs to me that as much as I complain about the Rolemasterization of D&D by turning classes into bizarrely structured training packages, I am essentially doing the same thing here by parceling out class abilities with some kind of feat-like system. Maybe I just can't get D&D to do what I'm trying to get it to do.
 

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Redthistle

Explorer
Supporter
Also, given that feats have been completely reworked from their implementation in 3e and 4e, are optional and compete for precious character-building resources, I do not want this system to be feat-based.

It occurs to me that as much as I complain about the Rolemasterization of D&D by turning classes into bizarrely structured training packages, I am essentially doing the same thing here by parceling out class abilities with some kind of feat-like system. Maybe I just can't get D&D to do what I'm trying to get it to do.

Like you, these issues also frustrate me. Your concluding paragraph made me think I was looking in the mirror. Not to mention, I've got this problem with every RPG I've ever played. [In my next life, I want to come back as God just to make sure everything is done MY WAY.]

I have to keep reminding myself that this is the very BASIC version of the game and that future supplements may well provide some of the tools I'm hoping for to bring the game closer to what my gaming group wants.

At most, I don't think any PC should have or need more than 3 Feats over 20 levels; that should be sufficient to allow the PC's primary ability to max out at 20, provide improvement in 1-2 other abilities, and give a few Feat-based enhancements to help individualize the PC as he/she advances.

It was in 4e that I learned to love the monk class. Almost every PC I created took at least one multi-class level of monk just to gain a slight edge when limited to an unarmed fight; the only place that I don't love a tavern brawl is in the real world (it interrupts my meal-time reading. About tavern brawls.).

Hmmm. Guess that's it. I seem to be lacking any profound ending thoughts.
 

DammitVictor

Trust the Fungus
Supporter
I have to keep reminding myself that this is the very BASIC version of the game and that future supplements may well provide some of the tools I'm hoping for to bring the game closer to what my gaming group wants.

More I think about it... the more I think "Basic" is the solution. 5e is the closest D&D has been to BECMI since BECMI, and a lot of what I want to do with it seems like it could come from taking similar approaches-- use the Building the Perfect Class article as guidelines, and then for campaign-specific options just hand out specific abilities. Still kinda at a loss for the weapon mastery rules and the nuts and bolts of the martial arts, but maybe bounded accuracy can be tweaked if you're careful with the math.
 


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