How do I build this character?

Malin Genie · Mar 23, 2003

You could just live with the fact that they are cross-class and your bonus won't be as high as if they were class skills. Invest a couple of Feats in Skill Focus to reflect the fact that you are, well, focussing on those skills!

In a PBP I am playing a Shaman; without using Cosmopolitan (a FR regional Feat not really applicable to an oriental campaign) I still get +10 Bluff, +10 Sense Motive and +14 Intimidate at 7th level with only 16 Charisma (Skill Focus: Intimidate; Persuasive; Skill Focus: Sense Motive) Do I really need much more than that to meet my character's concept of being able to read others like a book, being inscrutable and downright scary when she needs to be?

With 20 Charisma and synergy bonuses a 7th level sorceror can have +14 to Diplomacy, or +16 with Skill Focus (or Trustworthy, from Song and Silence.) Do you honestly need much more than that to meet your character concept of being oily, greasy, and able to talk your way our of a lynching at the hands of the angry mob to whom you just sold the snake oil? Even three or four cross-class ranks, if you focus on Cha (and possibly even get a Cha-boosting item) can get you a very decent bonus.

Destil · Mar 23, 2003

Use PH 94 to convince the DM to allow you to trade some class abilities (familiar, mabye access to a school of magic) for extra skill points and a better class skill list.

Particle_Man · Mar 23, 2003

feats

Kalamar has a d&d (not just d20 (not that there is anything wrong with that)) feat that is like cosmopolitan, but allows you to make one cross-class skill into a class skill for every int bonus you have. (skill prodigy). Hey, if you can go fr, why not kalamar?

But maybe 3.5e will change things for the sorceror.

Stalker0 · Mar 24, 2003

Probably the most painless way is to go one level of rogue. I mean, what's not to love- more hp, some weapon proficiences, and skills up the wazam.

Your going to need a high int though if you want to maintain the skills to high ranks if you go mainly sorc, 2 + int hurts.

dcollins · Mar 24, 2003

DerianCypher said:
Well, depending on what level you are you could substitute magic items for actual prowess

put 2 ranks cross-class into each skill then buy an item of +20 of each.. the items are cheap and would run you under 10,000gp to buy

Items like that do not appear in the core rules. Acquiring them would require a specific allowance for such "new items" on the part of the DM, and are not by default options available to any PCs.

www.superdan.net/dndfaq3.html

Dr_Rictus · Mar 24, 2003

Yeah, unless you also have quite a high Intelligence for a sorcerer, you're not going to have the skill points for social skills anyway. Certainly keeping useful levels of the four skills you list is going to be difficult without seriously compromising important magical skills (like Concentration and Spellcraft). But if you could only manage one social skill, it would be Bluff, because of the bounty of synergy bonuses it offers.

I might also note that Sense Motive isn't a Charisma-based skill anyway, though it also offers good synergy bonuses.

But, if that's the character concept you want, and you've got a plan for your skill points that you think you'll be happy with, then I'd say Cosmopolitan or Versitile is the way to go if you can swing 'em. They're at least close to the core, unlike getting your DM to switch to or allow the variant sorcerer (which I could go on about, but don't need to).

DiFier · Mar 24, 2003

Stalker0 said:
Probably the most painless way is to go one level of rogue. I mean, what's not to love- more hp, some weapon proficiences, and skills up the wazam.

Your going to need a high int though if you want to maintain the skills to high ranks if you go mainly sorc, 2 + int hurts.

I could be wrong but can't you sneak attack with rays? and other such spells?

Lord Pendragon · Mar 25, 2003

DiFier said:
I could be wrong but can't you sneak attack with rays? and other such spells?

You certainly can.

Thanks for all the suggestions, folks! There was a lot that I hadn't thought about when the original concept hit me. I like the concept, but I'm not sure I want to castrate a PC's effectiveness simply to fulfill a character quirk. I've played with people who created interesting but useless PCs, and I certainly wasn't happy when everyone was dying as a result of it.

I think that I may follow the advice on this thread, and take a look at the Diplomancer and perhaps Monte's alt.bard.

Thanks for the help, everyone. It certainly makes it easier to try new character concepts when you have the wisdom of thousands to tell you how not to screw up.

Caliban · Mar 25, 2003

Lord Pendragon said:
You certainly can.

Thanks for all the suggestions, folks! There was a lot that I hadn't thought about when the original concept hit me. I like the concept, but I'm not sure I want to castrate a PC's effectiveness simply to fulfill a character quirk. I've played with people who created interesting but useless PCs, and I certainly wasn't happy when everyone was dying as a result of it.

I think that I may follow the advice on this thread, and take a look at the Diplomancer and perhaps Monte's alt.bard.

Thanks for the help, everyone. It certainly makes it easier to try new character concepts when you have the wisdom of thousands to tell you how not to screw up.

It's not Core Rules, but there is a feat from the Codex Arcanis (by Paradigm) called Gentry that gives you Ride and Diplomacy as class skills, and a boost to your starting cash. It can only be taken at 1st level.

Chun-tzu · Mar 25, 2003

About the Diplomancer: While I think it's a good class, and pretty well-done, it's definitely not going to be the munchkin's first choice. For one, it loses 4 levels of spellcasting, and for another, the skill requirements are high for most wizards, sorcerers, and even Monte's own alt.sorcerers: 10 ranks in Diplomacy, 8 in Sense Motive. It's also heavily geared toward Enchantment.

So I think it might fall closer to that "interesting but useless" side than you'd like, which is a shame, because it would work well with your character concept.