Is the term "racism" being stretched too far, applied to too many things?

Umbran · Jul 16, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
In another example, does anyone really believe this mayor is so clueless to think what he's saying isn't racist?

Yep.

Now, that lack of self-knowledge alone is enough for people to want him out of office, but it is a fairly common occurrence - a person having biases that he or she doesn't know they have. He probably thought, "I don't like him, so I'll insult him," That, in and of itself, isn't racist. Even comparing politicians to animals is not itself racist - how many political cartoons have depicted politicians as pigs, for example?

But, it seems to me very likely that the exact form of insult came from a racial bias that he doesn't realize he has.

And, if he doesn't realize he has it, when confronted angrily on it, human nature makes it very, very likely that he'll dig in, and outright honestly believe that it wasn't racism that influenced his words.

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 16, 2015

Is it possible? Yes.

It's it likely? Given that- according to one newspaper in the area- he has a track record of past bigoted online posts that he has deleted or subsequently shifted to "private", I don't think so. He is at least aware enough of the controversial nature of his "jokes" that he's covering his tracks from the general public.

Homicidal_Squirrel · Jul 16, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
Exactly! (Tropic Thunder was da BOMB!)

In another example, does anyone really believe this mayor is so clueless to think what he's saying isn't racist? Or does he think that we're so gullible as to believe him?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/washington-mayor-racist_55a71677e4b04740a3defd84

I'm pretty sure he believes people are gullible enough to believe him. I'm going to call his claim that he isn't a racist total BS. Considering how many times it has come up on the news that someone has called Obama a monkey, and it has been called out as racist, I'm not going to buy into the whole it's not racist because it's "playful back and forth banter that my friends and I do." Hell, I'm willing to bet that "playful back and forth banter" is the same kind that happens during KKK meetings. Furthermore, considering that this is not the first instance, and this guy has a history of racist posts, yeah this guy is a racist that got caught and is now trying to play it off as a joke.

gamerprinter · Jul 16, 2015

Is this guy a racist? Yes. Should he arbitralily resign because of his comments? It depends. If his constuency are as clueless or racist as he, and not making a public outcry about it, then no, why should he resign? Undoubtably, many organizations and "political correctness" advocates are making outcries, but unless those organizations are making an impact on that mayor's constuency... if they don't care, I don't care. Now I wouldn't be eager to visit that town at any time, nor would recommend the community in a positive way for any reason. Personally I'm tired of political organizations throwing their weight around making demands, when they are not part of the direct constuency of a given political body. I'm speaking in local political terms only, if a national or state level politician is making bigotted remarks, then yes, such a person would and should be the target of such organizations, and should face repercussions. Should any form of bigotry lead to racially maligned laws or law enforcement practices, then yes, something needs to be done about it, but as long as the bias is verbal only, I'm not overly concerned. There are bigots out in the world, and there's no escaping that, and many are politicians. This is in America, so freedom of speech applies.

Janx · Jul 16, 2015

gamerprinter said:
Is this guy a racist? Yes. Should he arbitralily resign because of his comments? It depends. If his constuency are as clueless or racist as he, and not making a public outcry about it, then no, why should he resign? Undoubtably, many organizations and "political correctness" advocates are making outcries, but unless those organizations are making an impact on that mayor's constuency... if they don't care, I don't care. Now I wouldn't be eager to visit that town at any time, nor would recommend the community in a positive way for any reason. Personally I'm tired of political organizations throwing their weight around making demands, when they are not part of the direct constuency of a given political body. I'm speaking in local political terms only, if a national or state level politician is making bigotted remarks, then yes, such a person would and should be the target of such organizations, and should face repercussions. Should any form of bigotry lead to racially maligned laws or law enforcement practices, then yes, something needs to be done about it, but as long as the bias is verbal only, I'm not overly concerned. There are bigots out in the world, and there's no escaping that, and many are politicians. This is in America, so freedom of speech applies.

I'd say yes and no.

As you say, a bigot mayor in a town full of bigots is indeed representing the will of the people as a bigotted town. If the topic wasn't about bigotry, I'd say he's doing his job representing the will of the people.

However, I would bet that BigotVille is not 100% bigots, that there is in fact a minority.

And that minority is probably hurt in some fashion due to the bigoted nature of the leadership. If nothing else because BigotMayor is tacitly approving of bigoted behavior.

Bigotry is wrong basically. I'm pretty sure that ought to be a universal truth. Agreeing with hating black is quite a big different thing than having an opinion on deficit spending or welfare reform.

As such, when the people in power have "wrong" views, the minority has little recourse barring the Lee Harvey Oswald method. Let's agree that's another Universal Wrong.

We have to rely on the people in power to not use it to enforce their ideals (especially the bad ones) on everybody. Thus, since it is a person in power, it is a special situation that calls for either the A Team or a watchdog organization to come in and clean house.

In my view, this is the same reason why employers cannot be allowed to interfere with their employees healthcare choices over religious reasons. The guy in power already controls the pay check. They must not be given further control over their employees lives.

If the guy in power is not fair, is not just, he must be ejected from power. By whatever escalating means necessary.

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 16, 2015

However, I would bet that BigotVille is not 100% bigots, that there is in fact a minority.

Depends on the BigotVille in particular. I can't speak to THAT one, but sundown towns are still around, and they tend NOT to have significant minority populations, if any.

Take Vidor, Texas (PLEASE!): according to the US census, the racial makeup of the city was 97.33% White, 0.07% African American, 0.52% Native American, 0.19% Asian, 0.03% Pacific Islander, 0.66% from other races, and 1.21% from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 3.49% of the population.

Umbran · Jul 17, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
Is it possible? Yes.

It's it likely?

Yep. Still likely.

Given that- according to one newspaper in the area- he has a track record of past bigoted online posts that he has deleted or subsequently shifted to "private", I don't think so.

As I've already noted - the #1 defense in the face of angry confrontation is? Denial!

Or, to reuse the phrasing I used above - I think you underestimate the human capacity to self-delude

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 17, 2015

Zaphod Beeblebrox's glasses wouldn't be powerful enough to work like blinders THAT good.

Umbran · Jul 17, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
Zaphod Beeblebrox's glasses wouldn't be powerful enough to work like blinders THAT good.

Dude, I have had a discussion in which a person railed at me about, "the carcinogens They put in vaccines," all the while punctuating his remarks with deep drags on a cigarette.

The human ability to fail to use their grey matter can be astounding.

Janx · Jul 17, 2015

Umbran said:
Dude, I have had a discussion in which a person railed at me about, "the carcinogens They put in vaccines," all the while punctuating his remarks with deep drags on a cigarette.

The human ability to fail to use their grey matter can be astounding.

yeah, humans are stupid. And they suffer from that cognitive disassociation that lets them think "yes, cigarettes cause cancer, but not the one I'm smoking right now" while ranting about the cancer causing vaccines like a tinfoil hat person.

In the case of the Mayor of BigotVille, is it more effective or expedient to:
gently guide the mayor to Good thinking
put a bullet in his defective noggin
confront him directly about his racist ways
get him fired over a public outcry

If the list of choices is roughly the same, would you choose differently if it was your boss, your friend, a neighbor?