Are Asians not allowed in Superhero Movies?

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 22, 2015

MechaPilot said:
I don't know if that one is real or not. Assuming that it is, it likely happened at a time when rampant racism in Hollywood was either the norm or at least generally accepted.

It's real, from 1956.

And don't forget Mickey Rooney as Mr. Yunioshi in 1961's Breakfast At Tiffany's.

In the more modern era of equal rights, such behavior is definitely more generally offensive than it would have been back then.

Certainly, which is why when Emma Stone was cast as a person of Asian descent in Aloha* and all the heroes of the biblical epic Noah were caucasians (and all the villains were some kind of minority)**, there was a big stink raised.

* http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...a-stone-aloha-asian-casting-apology/28400233/

** http://www.patheos.com/blogs/tinsel...white-aronofsky-casts-all-europeans-for-noah/

MechaPilot · Jul 22, 2015

Crothian said:
Isn't the character type of the old Asian who is just there to teach the white guy mystical Asian secrets a racist concept to begin with? So, is it better to leave a racist concept like that or get rid of it by replacing it with a white person? As to the comment of Hollywood being self aware of this problem of course they aren't because to them it's not a problem.

I wouldn't say that the ancient Asian master is a "racist" concept, but it is an Asian stereotype. To me, racist implies negativity. For example, to me, if someone said all Asians are good at math, I wouldn't take that as being racist because it's not demeaning them with a negative trait, though it 100% is sterotyping them.

It's the same thing as people saying that black men are well-endowed, or that Jews know how to handle money (though changing financial skill to greed or a love for money crosses over to racism). It's definitely stereotyping, but it lacks that demeaning, dehumanizing quality that defines racism in my eyes.

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 22, 2015

Crothian said:
Isn't the character type of the old Asian who is just there to teach the white guy mystical Asian secrets a racist concept to begin with?

Yep, along with its black counterpart, often called the "Magical Negro".

So, is it better to leave a racist concept like that or get rid of it by replacing it with a white person?

Tough question, to which the answer can only be, "It depends."

If it is a white person advising white people on some kind of "mystic secrets of life", no problem.

But a white person doing likewise to people of color- especially in a film predominantly cast with minority actors- runs smack into the issue of white paternalism, aka "The White Man's Burden."

Rune · Jul 22, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
all the heroes of the biblical epic Noah were caucasians (and all the villains were some kind of minority)**, there was a big stink raised.

I don't think I saw the same movie as those people. In the version I saw, one of the two main villains was played by Russell Crowe.

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 22, 2015

Wasn't really interested in the movie, so didn't see it...but how do you characterize Noah as the villain in the story of the biblical flood?

Morrus · Jul 22, 2015

I haven't seen it either - it looks awful! - but isn't Ray Winstone a main villain?

I thought the common criticism of that movie is that it had no people of colour in it at all, not that they were all cast as villains. But like I said, I haven't seen it, so I have no idea how true that is.

gamerprinter · Jul 22, 2015

Well I've been convinced that Ancient Greece consists of hoplite soldiers as English speaking with Scottish accents. Look at the movies for Troy, 300, and many others - it must true!

Ryujin · Jul 22, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
Yep, along with its black counterpart, often called the "Magical Negro".

Not quite the same thing. You'll find the Sensei/Sifu concept in various Asian cultures. You'll see it in Asian movies, that have no relation to anything Hollywood. The "magical Negro", however, appears to be a whole-cloth invention of Hollywood.

Dannyalcatraz · Jul 22, 2015

Ryujin said:
Not quite the same thing. You'll find the Sensei/Sifu concept in various Asian cultures. You'll see it in Asian movies, that have no relation to anything Hollywood. The "magical Negro", however, appears to be a whole-cloth invention of Hollywood.

The Sensei IS a classic of Asian fiction, where it is an Asian teaching fellow Asians. However, it isn't as if Asians are the only ones with mystic figures who educate their own people- you'll find them in the native lore of EVERY culture, even African ones.

Besides, translated into Western fiction, the Sensei is predominantly the teacher of young Caucasians- Karate Kid, Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai, the monks who educated the mixed race Kwai Chang Kane in Kung Fu, countless Chuck Norris films... He is usually the only heroic Asian- or sometimes, the only Asian at all- in the film, and as such, it has become just an ethnically-changed Magical Negro.

As for Hollywood creating the Magical Negro, well, the trope/archetype predates film:

Jim- the character from Mark Twain's 1884's Huckleberry Finn- is considered to be one of the classic exemplars...5 years before the first motion picture.

Ryujin · Jul 22, 2015

Dannyalcatraz said:
The Sensei IS a classic of Asian fiction, where it is an Asian teaching fellow Asians. However, it isn't as if Asians are the only ones with mystic figures who educate their own people- you'll find them in the native lore of EVERY culture, even African ones.

Besides, translated into Western fiction, the Sensei is predominantly the teacher of young Caucasians- Karate Kid, Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai, the monks who educated the mixed race Kwai Chang Kane in Kung Fu, countless Chuck Norris films... He is usually the only heroic Asian- or sometimes, the only Asian at all- in the film, and as such, it has become just an ethnically-changed Magical Negro.

As for Hollywood creating the Magical Negro, well, the trope/archetype predates film: Jim- the character from Mark Twain's 1884's Huckleberry Finn- is considered to be one of the classic exemplars...5 years before the first motion picture.

True enough on the Sensei/Sifu archetype, where Hollywood is concerned. Yes, other cultures have the ancient teacher concept, but it doesn't tend to be as directly nor repeatedly ripped off as those of Asian cultures. It's typically more modernized. The only one that sees anywhere near as much abuse would be the North American Indian shaman.

Interesting. I wouldn't have put "Jim" in that category. It's certainly not as overt as a Laurence Fishburne (Morpheus), Tony Todd (Bludworth), or God (Morgan Freeman). There's a more generic term "Numinous Negro" indicating a black person of saintly or holy demeanour, who appears in fiction.

Are Asians not allowed in Superhero Movies?

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