Christian Persecution vs Persecuted Christians

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William Bonney

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Well from where I'm sitting, government and the media has a large role to play in that. Policies that are made into law as well as engineered or exclusive news coverage assists factions (sheep) towards a certain mentality.
Please don't use the word 'sheep' in a serious post unless you're referring to Ovis aries, it's really pretentious and detracts from your position.

It's generally accepted that the inverse process is the most accurate - that policy and ideology are drawn from broader social movements rather than policy creating social movements. I may have misread your post; if I did, my mistake.
 
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Sadras

Legend
Please don't use the word 'sheep' in a serious post unless you're referring to Ovis aries, it's really pretentious and detracts from your position.

Fair enough.

It's generally accepted that the inverse process is the most accurate - that policy and ideology are drawn from broader social movements rather than policy creating social movements. I may have misread your post; if I did, my mistake.

'Generally accepted' by whom?
Let us not forget it was the government that fed the media that fed the masses re 'Battle of Tonkin', Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq, Calories is the Bad Guy not Sugar...etc So I very much disagree with your statement.
If a certain agenda needs to be pushed through - it does. The reason you have increasing militant Christians or right-wingers advocating loss of rights is because of this fear installed of the 'others'. And who exactly is instilling this fear?
 

Sadras

Legend
Care to clarify?

Besides the series of embarrassing corruption/bribery charges over the last 15 years which have been levelled at the current and ex-president as well as their cabinets with no one being held accountable, the manufacturing industries have shrunk (and this is before the 2007/2008 economic meltdown) with the country going into bed with China in a big way - for little or no gain being realised for its needy people.
The above has helped weaken the currency - when the country became fully democratic in 1994 it was sitting at R3.60 to the 1$, 20 years on it is now R13 = R1.

They have people in the highest positions of power, who control the lives of the people they 'serve', who have neither been educated, nor do they have the experience. The current president has not even finished school. At what do we say, "Yup, we need one of the least educated to run a country."


Schooling has been dumbed down and instead of attempting to follow the education of the better countries, instead the country is adopting policies and curriculums of failed and poorly thought out systems. Recently they had university students throwing their excrement at old statues - and these students were acquitted of wrong doing. These are the bright minds we have to look forward to.

And don't take my word for it about the education, take a South African black person's perspective. There are hundreds of articles such as these reflecting how badly the country is being run.
http://mybroadband.co.za/news/gover...barians-who-are-racist-and-sexist-jansen.html

The BBBEE policies refer only to black persons without differentiating if these blacks need to be South African or from any other African country. This is a huge problem, because you find that the companies will hire black people, to fill their BBBEE quota, from other African countries which are better educated/ with more experience than the natives, leaving the South African blacks in no better position than they were before. And the country is filled with African immigrants.

Then you have native Africans on non-native African clashes - were locals become jealous of the non-natives' success or ingenuity and either threaten/harm/kill the immigrants and/or destroy their properties.

A large percentage of the municipalities under the ANC do not receive clean audits.

Monies are being spend needlessly in name-changing programmes 20 years on.

Furthermore in 1994 the country was generating more energy output for electricity than it is today. Why would that be, given that they wanted to put more people on the power grid? Its inefficient management and vision - which has led to 'load shedding'. For the last 5+ years the country as experienced planned electricity cuts (which never occurred before), which leads to a decrease in the countries output, decrease in foreign investments, lower GDP..etc
And there is a prediction that water shortages will be on their way. This is how it started in Zimbabwe.
So the ANC inherited a working infrastructure only to start dismantling it 20 years on...

I'm not saying good has not occurred with the fall of Apartheid, but certainly not nearly enough - and given the current 'fat cat' leaders of the ruling political party and their antics it is not looking promising for a country which is rather rich (gold, platinum, iron, copper, coal, diamonds, timber, agriculture, access to the ocean).
 
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Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Supporter
It's generally accepted that the inverse process is the most accurate - that policy and ideology are drawn from broader social movements rather than policy creating social movements.

I think modern media has gone a long way to enabling the creation of "movements" out of desired policy, rather than the other way around.
 

William Bonney

First Post
Fair enough.



'Generally accepted' by whom?
Let us not forget it was the government that fed the media that fed the masses re 'Battle of Tonkin', Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq, Calories is the Bad Guy not Sugar...etc So I very much disagree with your statement.
If a certain agenda needs to be pushed through - it does. The reason you have increasing militant Christians or right-wingers advocating loss of rights is because of this fear installed of the 'others'. And who exactly is instilling this fear?

Accepted by modern sociologists. You're just making obtuse, conspiracy-theory-laden statements.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Supporter
Accepted by modern sociologists. You're just making obtuse, conspiracy-theory-laden statements.

Not really. Appeals to authority are problematic to begin with. Vague, "everyone knows," authority is even worse. At least now there is a framework around what you've asserted, and someone curious could double-check, go read up on some sociology, and see if it hangs together.
 

Sadras

Legend
Accepted by modern sociologists. You're just making obtuse, conspiracy-theory-laden statements.

Look, do not take my word for it, my suggestion is for you to do some research about 'media manipulation' and see for yourself what results/articles come up.
 

They have people in the highest positions of power, who control the lives of the people they 'serve', who have neither been educated, nor do they have the experience. The current president has not even finished school. At what do we say, "Yup, we need one of the least educated to run a country."

Schooling has been dumbed down and instead of attempting to follow the education of the better countries, instead the country is adopting policies and curriculums of failed and poorly thought out systems. Recently they had university students throwing their excrement at old statues - and these students were acquitted of wrong doing. These are the bright minds we have to look forward to.

And don't take my word for it about the education, take a South African black person's perspective. There are hundreds of articles such as these reflecting how badly the country is being run.
http://mybroadband.co.za/news/gover...barians-who-are-racist-and-sexist-jansen.html

The BBBEE policies refer only to black persons without differentiating if these blacks need to be South African or from any other African country. This is a huge problem, because you find that the companies will hire black people, to fill their BBBEE quota, from other African countries which are better educated/ with more experience than the natives, leaving the South African blacks in no better position than they were before. And the country is filled with African immigrants.
Well, to be honest, the education issues, and the President's lack of education are largely a consequence of your own making. They are a product of an apartheid education system. You reap what you sow, and all that good stuff.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Supporter
Well, to be honest, the education issues, and the President's lack of education are largely a consequence of your own making. They are a product of an apartheid education system. You reap what you sow, and all that good stuff.

I have to agree with H_S here. Apartheid ended only 20 years ago. There then has to be generational change before people who were given horrible education previously will be up to speed.

You can't blame people for not instantaneously overcoming the results of institutional racism.
 

Ryujin

Legend
I have to agree with H_S here. Apartheid ended only 20 years ago. There then has to be generational change before people who were given horrible education previously will be up to speed.

You can't blame people for not instantaneously overcoming the results of institutional racism.

Yup, given that national level politicians tend to be in their late 40s or early 50s, at the youngest, they almost certainly would have been done with any schooling by the time that Apartheid ended. It'll likely be another 10 years, at best, before well educated Black South African politicians rise to the fore.
 

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