"Well, what's wrong with slavery?"

Umbran · Aug 28, 2015

gamerprinter said:
Sure I agree, but assign generalities based on what one candidate and one radio host stated is very dangerous thinking.

You want us to start finding the comments and policies from the various current GOP presidential candidates that show such positions? Do you really think we will have a problem doing so? If we find the majority of the GOP presidential candidates - the people who are going to represent the party in elections, and possibly hold the highest office in the land - hold such positions, how can we then say the party (as a collective, not as individuals) isn't such?

A little while back, a form of sexism argument came up. When women would say they'd experienced sexism, a man would retort, "Not all men do that!" It is a defensive deflection that 1) Make it about the man's righteousness, rather than the woman's experiences, and 2) effectively implies that there isn't a problem. The answer was, "Maybe not, but *all* women!" The fact of the matter is that *enough* men are sexist that the problem is real and ubiquitous for women, and therefore needs to be addressed.

Thus, in analogy, I say that the fact that not all Republicans are personally overt racists does not mean that the GOP's racist policy proposals are not a problem.

There is a point where, as a person of conscience, one should look at any group you affiliate with and say, "You know what? This group has gone too far," rather than protest, "Not all of us are like that!" At that point, you have two choices - leave the group, or work to change the group. Because, if you maintain affiliation as it is, and not worry about it, you are tacitly approving of the behavior.

Kramodlog · Aug 28, 2015

was said:
..So, all Republicans are racist because some of them once tried to recruit Democrat racists?

Hello strawman my old friend. You've come to talk to me again...

Anyway, the Southern Strategy marks the start of the modern Republican party's appeal to white racist. It isn't the only people it trys to get in its coalition. Evangelists are another group. So are libertarians. Nowadays they'll say that immigrants need to self-deport, that a wall needs to be build between the US and Mexico or that there is a plague of anchor babies (which there isn't any evidence of), to appeal to racists. It is a soft appeal. No need to call anyone names or say they are inferior.

They'll say that voting needs to be controlled to prevent fraud, but there is very little evidence of electoral fraud. Controlling votes just makes it harder for some minorities and the poor to vote. And that is a good thing for Republicans as those democraphics tend to vote Democrate.

Trump takes it further by being far less subtle and now Republicans are paying the price of appealing to racists and including them in their base. If people are still following Trump after he said Hispanics are behinf rapes in the US's, why shouln't I consider these people racist?

Dannyalcatraz · Aug 28, 2015

was said:
...LOL, I think that Kansas is so, 'conservative', that even the most ardent Rebublicans question some of their views.

Yeah- even some of the current state legislators are starting to voice concerns about the path Kansas is on.

Kramodlog · Aug 28, 2015

gamerprinter said:
Sure I agree, but assign generalities based on what one candidate and one radio host stated is very dangerous thinking.

Saying negative things about immigrants, inner city kids, wanting build walls, favoring deportation, are pretty common comments among Republican candidates.

Dannyalcatraz · Aug 28, 2015

There is a point where, as a person of conscience, one should look at any group you affiliate with and say, "You know what? This group has gone too far," rather than protest, "Not all of us are like that!" At that point, you have two choices - leave the group, or work to change the group. Because, if you maintain affiliation as it is, and not worry about it, you are tacitly approving of the behavior.

Several newly minted Independents & Democrats are former members of the GOP.

As I recall, all all of the current presidential hopefuls on the Democratic side are former Republicans.

Janx · Aug 28, 2015

trappedslider said:
let's see if i can sum this all up : all republicans bad evil juju all democrats less bad evil juju..all conservatives bad evil juju alll liberals less bad evil juju...

EDIT: Note that the above is not my own personal views it

yeah, that's pretty much it

As I noted in several of my posts where I list the "sins" of the Republican party, I am likely unable to see what "bad" things the Democratic party may also be standing for.

When Republicans support Hobby Lobby interfering in a woman's right to use her health insurance for birth control, they are violating HIPPA and enforcing their dominance over a woman's free right to choose how to use her money in a way that isn't applied to men.

When somebody counters that Democrats want to be "Socialism" as if that's a bad thing, I'd have to ask, how is that singling out a demographic? How exactly is Socialism itself specifically wrong? How does it mean there won't be any capitalism.

This is why the list is so long on the Republican side. There is just too much discrimination against specific groups of people. A lot of backed by religious reasoning, and ironically, a lot of it contrary to the very teachings of that religions key figure.

Dannyalcatraz · Aug 28, 2015

One thing distinguishing the Democrats' radical fringe from the more radical elements of the GOP is that the ultra-left Democrats tend not to rise very high within the organization. At least, not in the past few decades.

was · Aug 28, 2015

goldomark said:
Trump takes it further by being far less subtle and now Republicans are paying the price of appealing to racists and including them in their base. If people are still following Trump after he said Hispanics are being rapes in the US's, why shouln't I consider these peopel racist?

..Does Trump bring out the conservative radicals? Yes, he does.
..Are many of those conservative radicals racist? Yes, they are.
..Do they represent the Republican party as a whole? No, they don't.
..Are there racist Democrats? Sure there are.

..Stereotyping all Republicans as racists, is just as ignorant as Trump stereotyping all Mexicans as rapists.

billd91 · Aug 28, 2015

was said:
..Does Trump bring out the conservative radicals? Yes, he does.
..Are many of those conservative radicals racist? Yes, they are.
..Do they represent the Republican party as a whole? No, they don't.
...Are there racist Democrats? Sure there are.

...Stereotyping all Republicans as racist is just as ignorant as Trump stereotyping all Mexicans as rapists.

It may be unfortunate stereotyping to paint all Republican with the racist brush... but you also have to look at the collective output of GOP voters. Are racist policies coming out of the GOP? Look at the minority targeting voter suppression laws coming out. Now how is it that non-racist Republicans somehow generate racist policy? And can't the GOP voters be held accountable for the actions of the party they support considering their votes may well have contributed to that party's electoral success and taking the reins of government?

prosfilaes · Aug 28, 2015

was said:
..Does Trump bring out the conservative radicals? Yes, he does.
..Are many of those conservative radicals racist? Yes, they are.
..Do they represent the Republican party as a whole? No, they don't.

Does anything represent the Republican party as a whole? Certainly the leader in the polls for the Republican nomination is a good warning sign of the underlying nature of the party. In arguments like this, there's always a lot of goalpost moving; what represents the good side of my group is not what represents the bad side of my group, nor the good side of your group. Even when the goalposts don't move, there's (at least implied) equivocation; talking about the group as a group on the stage of life, and then talking about the True Scotsman members of the group. Certainly if you remove the conservative radicals from the Republicans, they would fail to win presidential elections, and most close elections anywhere in the country.