Agreed, now I haven't done it yet, but if someone has 20 times they can play and chooses to DM 19 of them it's not unreasonable that the 20th time if it's a tier 3/4 option that they turn in all their hard work and games they provided for the community while growing it, to cash in and play that tier 3/4 module and be able to have an appropriate amount of items for the tier to enjoy something other than tier 1 play.
Future of the current Adventure League
Agreed, now I haven't done it yet, but if someone has 20 times they can play and chooses to DM 19 of them it's not unreasonable that the 20th time if it's a tier 3/4 option that they turn in all their hard work and games they provided for the community while growing it, to cash in and play that tier 3/4 module and be able to have an appropriate amount of items for the tier to enjoy something other than tier 1 play.
I don't think it's worth fricking the individual points here, but I think @Pauper's concerns are somewhat valid on their face while missing the larger picture. To whit:
- It's not logistically possible to do anything outside of the honor system. AL is a massive, global organization of hundreds (thousands?) of players with a budget of functionally zero. It's simply not possible to build an auditing infrastructure to support it.
- D&D is largely supported by its oldest, most selfless fans. For every store that hosts packed AL tables of players playing with basic/SRD/pirated books are probably 3 or so DMs that rarely play, buy everything and work hard for everyone else to have a good time. Lose those three players and you lose 10-20 other players. So of course the rewards are biased toward old timers and people who DM a lot.
- Character mix-ups (intentional or accidental) don't actually ruin tables that much. D&D isn't competitive. DMs are empowered to adjust adventures. And if you really think about it, most players don't actually want a lot of challenge anyway. It's only real impact is your personal morale if you let someone else's mistakes impact your fun. In the end those players are just cheating themselves.
As a player who's got thousands of XP worth of unclaimed DM rewards (dedicated DM almost twice over for S5, and would have got it for S4 if S4's rewards were time-based instead of count-based), but has only played maybe 20 hours of D&D in the last year, I really appreciate some of the rewards you specifically dislike because they make me feel like giving up my rare play time has a benefit.
And funny enough, even though I consistently DM at local games and conventions I attend, it remains implausible that I could achieve King of the Ordning — although I wish I could.
Could the program be improved? Sure. I could see a limit of one item reward per PC, for example. But I think the program is directionally good.
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Ironically, I'm actually in favor of changes to encourage spending of more item rewards on a PC...
Right now, for people who don't have enormous piles of Dedicated DM rewards (i.e. occasional DMs like myself, I've earned 2 Dedicated DM rewards over the course of my time DMing) you're heavily incentivized to save those rewards for something epic, something that will be useful for the entire span of a PC's career. That's almost never going to be a Tier 1 item. I'd like to shuffle the hours requirement so that uncommons are cheaper, rares are around what it costs now, very rares are more expensive and legendaries are available, but maybe cost twice what a Dedicated DM costs now. Then let DMs trade up, cash your Uncommon in for half it's hours credit toward something else. Give me a reason to buy a little item now for my Tier 1 PC, but don't make me hang on to it forever. Similarly you could envision a DM reward that would let you assign a +1 weapon (like the A Great Upheaval DM quest now), but then have other rewards that let you tack on more pluses when that character is in Tier 2 or 3. Right now you're incentivized not to use low level rewards because they just make it harder to pick up other items in the future because they'll always stick to your magic item count and you have no ability to trade them away for more useful stuff.
Generally though, I agree with everything else RCanine is saying. The system seems to basically work.
Warmaster Horus
Explorer
Pauper has this impression that anyone who DMs out of any motivation than to serve the muse of gaming shouldn't DM at all. I know lots of DMs who do it because they love it and because they like the incentives provided by DM rewards. That's not a bad thing. People like to see their efforts recognized with tangible rewards. Do players mind if the DM doesn't hand out xp at the end of a game session? Shouldn't they just be playing for the fun of the game? Playing for selfish rewards like xp, gold, DT and Renown just cheapens their experience, right?
I don't mind the mods meeting up a bit more with the Hardcovers. The HCs define a season, after all. I like being able to take the character that I'm playing in SKT and have them expand that experience closely. I remember in Season 1 trying to think of h reasons why my character was traveling hundreds of miles to the Moonsea every couple of months before heading back to the Sword Coast. Didn't really matter much in the long run, but having a closer tie in may mean more meaningful character narrative for those who that's important to.
I don't mind the mods meeting up a bit more with the Hardcovers. The HCs define a season, after all. I like being able to take the character that I'm playing in SKT and have them expand that experience closely. I remember in Season 1 trying to think of h reasons why my character was traveling hundreds of miles to the Moonsea every couple of months before heading back to the Sword Coast. Didn't really matter much in the long run, but having a closer tie in may mean more meaningful character narrative for those who that's important to.
nswanson27
First Post
Good point. I don't think this whole issue is actually much of a concern by players in practice. Not that I've seen anyways. Certain niche views tend to be over-represented on this forum a lot.
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skerritthegreen
Explorer
I've seen ample complaints from both sides, which leads me to believe its probably about right.
I'm pleased you've been able to develop this mystical talent -- I don't even always know what my motivations are!
As it stands, though, looking back over my comments on the issue, I don't think I've ever made the point that DMs have to run to preserve the purity of the game and have to do so without rewards. My point, going all the way back to my observations about DM award gold, have been that those rewards should be appropriate and not abusive or excessive.
And for those who say, "Oh, well those people are cheating." So they are! But if nobody enforces the rule, and unless I'm the DM I don't have the authority to do so, then cheating is not just allowed, but effectively encouraged, since there's no repercussions for doing so.
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Pauper
Yep. Just like there have been people criticizing President Trump, and other people complaining that the criticisms are unwarranted, so on the whole he must be doing a great job!
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Pauper
Well, sure. But you can craft your rules/benefits in such a way that it doesn't take a savant to detect wrongdoing, and that doesn't encourage exploitation. The faction-specific magic item purchase options are a good example of that -- all you need is access to one table to confirm that a player selected the right item when making a faction item purchase, and given the rules for changing factions, it's fairly easy to figure out if someone is trying shenanigans to exploit the rule.
The real problem is that it's practically impossible to playtest these kinds of things before releasing them to the AL as a whole, so even if you figure out that a DM award or other benefit is abusive, the damage is already out there before you get a chance to change it.
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Pauper
Warmaster Horus
Explorer
With statements like ... "Regardless, the point is that, if the only reason you consider DMing is to rack up DM Quests, maybe you shouldn't be DMing." ... you seem to have an opinion about why DMs should participate in AL and it doesn't seem very favorable to DM Quests. I really couldn't care less if a DM is running because they want to rack those up. That's their business.
We have begun doing player audits before play at some events. Just a look through logs and seeing if anything pops out, like a 20 stat at 5th level or a magic item that seems out of place. As a DM I've asked a few questions, clarified what needs to be logged and asked some players who were bringing in non-AL characters to start a new one or grab a pre-gen. Nearly all players seem to be in accord with only new and young players being the ones who need clarification.
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