D&D 4E Optimized Monk Builds: 4e

Junkyard Dog · Apr 15, 2017

Thanks for posting these. I am planning to play a halfling monk in a long-term (1-30) campaign. Your handbook indicates Desert Wind is good for halflings. Would I be better off with Desert Wind or, as I am thinking, modifying the Firegoat build (which is Dex/Cha, as the halfling can also do) and taking Werebear for extra damage, since the halfling can't take Sarifal Waywarden?

MwaO · Apr 17, 2017

Junkyard Dog said:
Thanks for posting these. I am planning to play a halfling monk in a long-term (1-30) campaign. Your handbook indicates Desert Wind is good for halflings. Would I be better off with Desert Wind or, as I am thinking, modifying the Firegoat build (which is Dex/Cha, as the halfling can also do) and taking Werebear for extra damage, since the halfling can't take Sarifal Waywarden?

That's generally a decent option. Just be aware that Centered Breath is killer for Monk, even if your Wisdom isn't that great, especially with Wearbear's +1d10 for Lion's Den, +1d10 for Centered Breath and +1d10 for Lion's Den damage kicker...

darkbard · Apr 17, 2017

MwaO says it in the guide, but I must reiterate: Centered Breath monks are so much fun!

MwaO · Nov 29, 2017

Noted that there's a 1st level version of the 4th level Striker Monk who can do 56 damage on the nova turn and then follow up with 31 damage on round 2. Enough damage that a 1st level Monk can one round an Elite and then follow up by one-shotting a Standard.

Next time someone starts mouthing off about Monks, pull that out at 1st level and watch some jaws drop.

darkbard · Nov 30, 2017

Feedback for feedback's sake, so it's less of an echo chamber around here. ;^)

The accuracy claims for the 4th level Striker Monk, don't hold true (as much) for the 1st level iteration: no Cunning Stalker. A lot depends on enemy positioning, and, of course, this sequence is only on AP nova rounds. Will require retraining of feats, items to maintain the 2x/round FoB across early levels, which may be an issue in some games, I guess.

Still, an impressive build all around that should put to rest the Monk haters.

MwaO · Nov 30, 2017

darkbard said:
Feedback for feedback's sake, so it's less of an echo chamber around here. ;^)

The accuracy claims for the 4th level Striker Monk, don't hold true (as much) for the 1st level iteration: no Cunning Stalker. A lot depends on enemy positioning, and, of course, this sequence is only on AP nova rounds. Will require retraining of feats, items to maintain the 2x/round FoB across early levels, which may be an issue in some games, I guess.

Still, an impressive build all around that should put to rest the Monk haters.

Thanks!

At 1st level, it is a +5 vs NAD, which ought to mean hitting on a 7, or 70% to-hit. Enemy positioning shouldn't be that big of a deal - Elf Monk with move of 7 should be able engage somebody.

Here are the four possible outcomes:
Hit on 1st swing, hit on second = 49% of the time.
Hit on 1st swing, miss on second = 21%. Elven Accuracy converts 70% of these into successes = 14.7%
Miss on 1st, hit on second = 21%. Elven Accuracy converts 70% of these into successes = 14.7%
Miss both times = 9%. Elven Accuracy sad, but still converts 6.3% with Burning Flourish going for round 2.

So that's a 78.4% chance of success with an extra 6.3% that things will be decent the next round. Have a flank or dazed opponent or something similar and chances go way up:
64/4, 16/16, 16 = 12.8 for 89.6% and 3.2% for next round.

darkbard · Jan 2, 2018

Having a closer look at this, and some questions came up:

MwaO said:
Standard: Blistering Flourish(1d6+Dex+1(Ki Focus)+2(Iron Armbands) = +8

Blistering Flourish does 1d8 + Dex

Centered Flurry of Blows(2+2(Wis)+Boosted +2 for Ki Weapon's property, 2 for Crashing Weapon Style)

I do not understand what you mean by "Boosted +2 for Ki Weapon's property." The superior implement Mighty ki focus adds a bonus to attack reflex and empowered crit. Whither the +2 damage?

This will do ...
FoB: 14(4+2+2+1(BF)+5(SB))

Again, can you explain the extra +2 here?

Ki Club +1 x1

I'm still not clear on the ki focus rules. Why would a regular club using the ki focus properties not receive all the same benefits?

masteraleph · Jan 2, 2018

darkbard said:
Having a closer look at this, and some questions came up:

Blistering Flourish does 1d8 + Dex

I do not understand what you mean by "Boosted +2 for Ki Weapon's property." The superior implement Mighty ki focus adds a bonus to attack reflex and empowered crit. Whither the +2 damage?

Again, can you explain the extra +2 here?

I'm still not clear on the ki focus rules. Why would a regular club using the ki focus properties not receive all the same benefits?

To be clear here, you're looking at the Level 5 low level Monk build, correct? That build has a Mighty Blurred Strike Ki Focus +1 that it's making attacks with, and is holding a club with the Ki Weapon +1 enchantment (from PHB3), which deals 2 extra damage once/turn to FoB targets. And because it's on a club, it also gets the Crashing Tempest bonus. I do think it should be 2 lower on the second FoB, though, because it's not clear to me that Blurred Strike Ki Focus lets you get the +2 from Ki Weapon again.

darkbard · Jan 2, 2018

MwaO said:
Monk with way of establishing multiple vulnerabilities
[sblock=Wood Elf Radiant Fist Monk 13]
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Burning Flame Striker Monk, level 13
Elf, Monk, Radiant Fist
Monastic Tradition Option: Centered Breath
Versatile Expertise Option: Versatile Expertise (Light blade)
Versatile Expertise Option: Versatile Expertise (Ki Focuses)
Auspicious Birth (Auspicious Birth Benefit)
Theme: Sarifal Feywarden

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 9, CON 14, DEX 23, INT 11, WIS 18, CHA 11

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
STR 8, CON 13, DEX 18, INT 10, WIS 13, CHA 10

AC: 28 Fort: 27 Ref: 28 Will: 26
HP: 95 Surges: 9 Surge Value: 23

TRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +17, Perception +17, Religion +11, Stealth +17, Thievery +17

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +6, Athletics +5, Bluff +6, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +10, Endurance +8, Heal +10, History +6, Insight +10, Intimidate +6, Nature +14, Streetwise +6

POWERS
Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack
Sarifal Feywarden Utility: Sarifal's Blessing
Elf Racial Power: Elven Accuracy
Monk Feature: Centered Flurry of Blows
Feat Utility: Solar Enemy
Monk Attack 1: Lion's Den
Monk Attack 1: Five Storms
Monk Attack 1: Drunken Monkey
Monk Attack 1: Spinning Leopard Maneuver
Monk Utility 2: Cat and Mouse
Monk Attack 5: Water Gives Way
Monk Utility 6: Quicksilver Motion
Rogue Attack 7: Circling Predator
Monk Attack 9: Lightning Leap
Monk Utility 10: Iron Dragon Defense
Radiant Fist Attack 11: Divine Sun
Radiant Fist Utility 12: Undimmed Sun
Monk Attack 13: Dance of the Stinging Hornet

FEATS
Level 1: Cunning Stalker
Level 2: Crashing Tempest Style->Starblade Flurry @ 11th
Level 4: Superior Implement Training (Incendiary dagger)
Level 6: Sneak of Shadows
Level 8: Novice Power
Level 10: Versatile Expertise
Level 11: Fiery Blood
Level 11: Solar Enemy
Level 12: Improved Defenses

ITEMS
Monk unarmed strike
Shielding Dagger +1 x1
Spirit Fetch
Flaming Incendiary dagger +2 x1
Rain of Hammers Ki Focus +1 x1
Siberys Shard of the Mage (paragon tier)
Amulet of Protection +3 x1
Magic Cloth Armor (Basic Clothing) +3 x1
Iron Armbands of Power (heroic tier) x1
Rushing Cleats x1
====== End ======

Encounter Nova:
Free Action: Quicksilver Motion up to target
Minor: Sarifal's Blessing
Move->Minor: Solar Enemy
AP: Lion's Den(1d6+19+4 rad+10+5)
Standard: Lion's Den(1d6+19+4 rad+10+5)
Cat & Mouse on a hit
Flurry of Blows(6+4+5) - up to 3 targets
Lion's Den(2+10+5)*2 = 132 - and 34 damage 1/turn to any opponents who move up to him

Round 2:
Move: Dance of the Stinging Hornet(2d10+19+4 rad+10+5) = 49
Standard: Circling Predator(1d4+13+4 rad+10+5)*2 = 65
Flurry of Blows(6+4+5) = 15
129 damage
[/sblock]

Just out of curiosity's sake, what Paragon route would you go if you were to build this fellow for, say, a Dark Sun campaign wherein Divine options are verboten.

darkbard · Jan 2, 2018

masteraleph said:
To be clear here, you're looking at the Level 5 low level Monk build, correct? That build has a Mighty Blurred Strike Ki Focus +1 that it's making attacks with, and is holding a club with the Ki Weapon +1 enchantment (from PHB3), which deals 2 extra damage once/turn to FoB targets. And because it's on a club, it also gets the Crashing Tempest bonus. I do think it should be 2 lower on the second FoB, though, because it's not clear to me that Blurred Strike Ki Focus lets you get the +2 from Ki Weapon again.

Good to see you around here, masteraleph! You've actually addressed all my questions: somehow it eluded me that there is a distinct item enchantment called a Ki Weapon.

I need to go back and read the post in MwaO's class guide about how ki focuses and ki weapons interact!