Custom Race Idea.... The Living Weapon

The ability to possess a minion who is holding the Primordial Artifact with a fairly straight forward wis or cha attack just entered into consideration. Though its really just a side-effect in some sense of the bond ability... it is a little more awesome this way.

The mechanism for getting the ummm subsumed minion to perform some unique skill might be akin to one of my practices its like digging deep and sleep walking with the supressed mind mostly in control.

Garthanos said:

Thanks for your thoughts by the way.

If you wanted that to be your characters story shrug reflavor away gungadin.... Being able to posess a nobody and elevate them to a reflection of your status is probably a built in ability.

HOWEVER - If you were these arrogant potent items as mighty as a hero in your own right would you want to be bonded with that peasant who really isn't contributing anything to your symbiosis.

And you still would want something like the abilities which allows you to absorb other magic weapons (transfer their enchantments to you and similar abilities).

I think there is plenty of interesting elements for a race with a classic but different flavor to it.

Click to expand...

It is simply that a low level commoner is the one mostly likely to pick you up since they are the most numerous, chances is are that a low level commoner is the one that is going to pick up that sword, and also they are the ones mostly easily defeated in an ego contest, that an intelligent sword can control. Now this works best of the goals of the peasant and the goals of the sword are somewhat aligned. The peasant has some problems, he has a family to feed, he has to deal with the lord of the holdings he farms and give a percentage of his crop to him. Just some usual everyday problems that a peasant faces in his life. Now the peasant has a magic sword. Turns out there was a massive battle on his farm 100 years ago, there were two armies, one of orcs and one led by a king, the king was the possessor of this sword, but in this battle the orcs were victorious, although they were later defeated in another battle. This battle occurred during a rainstorm, the fields were flooded, the King was slain by an arrow, and his sword went plop in the mud when he fell, further chaos in the field further buried the sword, the orcs never found it! The sword itself is a +5 sword. The +5 sword easily wins an ego contest with the farmer, it is not an evil aligned sword however, the farmer brings the sword home to his family, through the farmer's eyes, the sword assesses the situation. The sword is inert and unaware unless it is possessed by someone, that person doesn't need to be holding it all the time, but he does need to be close, say within 100 feet of it and so forth. The farmer is not aware he is being controlled by the sword, he just feels an urge to keep the sword relatively close, but the sword sees through the farmer's eyes and hears through his ears.

You know how the saying goes, when your a hammer, all problems look like nails. The sword is going to look for problems that the farmer has, which might be solved with a sword. Maybe for instance the Noble ruling the land is a bit oppressive, his taxes are a bit high, and he abuses his power a bit. The Sword takes note, does not like this situation and works on a way to improve it. The peasant is going to need some resources if he is going to overthrow this local lord. the peasant goes to a local tavern, hears rumors about some ancient ruins where there may be treasure. The sword convinces the peasant that maybe he should check this out, maybe get some other people involved as well. The peasant on his own would not ordinarily do this, which is what the ego contest is for. The sword tries hard not to get the peasant killed, so it makes a plan, convinces the peasant to look for some companions that would help it to complete its quest.

Thomas Bowman said:

What if the person who picks you up is a 1st level Commoner Peasant, who plowed you up out of his field where one hundred years ago there was a great battle and your last wielder was slain? Somehow in the aftermath of that battle the sword got buried, and it only got plowed up again when the farmer was plowing his field for spring planting, because of its magic dweomer, the sword is not corroded from spending 100 years buried under the dirt. The farmer sees a valuable object in his field, and so he picks it up.

Click to expand...

He picked it up because Fate decreed that it was time for The Living Weapon to return to the stories of men! Buried in the heart of that farmer (or maybe his son, that would be dramatically cool) is the spirit of a hero! Roll up your new character.

My spin on him is he's a young guy, not married yet, his father was killed by the Evil Duke's men. He hankers for justice, but he's not really a REVENGE! type of guy, though he will certainly channel his anger and indignation at his personal brush with injustice to inspire him to get the job done. Presumably he's a fighter, but you could imagine him turning out to be a Paladin (he goes to the local temple to pray and his uncle the priest tells him of the secret, when he was blessed there as a newborn a voice spoke out from the altar declaring that he would return some day to take up his holy duty). I'm sure you could spin a ranger, or a warlord out of this easily enough too. Obviously a little change of backstory could get you a barbarian as well, or a Warden perhaps.

In any case, my spin on the living weapon is that the wielder supplies the particulars of the personality of the relationship. The weapon has its goals and the end result is sort of a fusion of the two. I'd mechanically represent it almost like a revenant, with the primary race overlaid with the special functions of the weapon. 4e should handle this really well.

Thomas Bowman said:

It is simply that a low level commoner is the one mostly likely to pick you up since they are the most numerous, chances is are that a low level commoner is the one that is going to pick up that sword, and also they are the ones mostly easily defeated in an ego contest, that an intelligent sword can control.

Click to expand...

Elric was arguably not defeated just influenceable and that was what Stormbringer liked in fact arguably Elric's awesomeness influenced Stormbringer to use him as its vehicle.

These weapons are not victims of chance about who picks them up? or who they will fight with? that just isn't the case.

Since they can readily possess a subject transferring themselves to a new more "worthy" one is pretty easy when they find a new worthy one they can further resist someone attempting to pull them from a stone or from a sheath. The ego contest can be as much to find who they can team up with as anything else. Someone who is an abject failure like a minion class character is obviously a stepping stone to better things.

ie remember from the point of view of this artifact and it is as powerful as any artifact with fully heroic ability ... the person controlling them is their weapon even if the control or influence of the superior subject isnt absolute.

Its a bit like do you want someone who can barely do a basic attack each turn.. on your team? You may have 100 percent control of that minion class character but he might not have any real ability worth adding to the set expcept a peasants submission to your will. In fact as a subsumed character he probably would never level.. and its going to be progressively weaker.

Stormbringer wanted a "player" on the stage of history to be wielding it... Excalibur would let none but a king to do so as I said if you want your character to settle for a peasant ummmmmm yeh then you are a peasant among your kind.

Most of the weapons I mentioned are also able to Dance ie they can hover in the air or fly about attacking even not in the grasp of ally.

Stormbringer after the bindings were broken, the Peri from the Invisible war and most all of those on the other sources could also take human form temporarily at least. In the soul eater anime many take that human form and socialize with wielders. Most can be dancing weapons and are attackable directly enticing enemies to attack them not just their wielders and when smashed bleeding magic light (again see Stormbringer for descriptions of a bleeding and screaming magic weapon) -- they are just more potent with a wielder and the wielder is more potent with them.

Mind speach will also being on the racial power list by the way.

The possibility of the Sword wielding a minion instead of being teamed with a Hero does bring up a useful game balance point.

Basically with the model in question from a pragmatic point of view the symbiotic benefits those gained by the party as a whole would have to compete with the party getting a minion servant who will typically last one fight then need replaced (even though it might be more flavorful than that).

Assume the symbiotic ability mentioned above works identically with a minion or another hero then the first real attack against your character will shut down the mind of your host and deprive you of that basic attack.

Now since combining with a hero does not intrinsically mechanically ADD a component to the parties side of the fight there needs to be an additional benefit akin to the ability to trigger an extra basic attack or two by those of heroic.

The player who wanted his magic sword wielding a minion could then be contributing roughly equal side by side to the one bound to another heroic archetype.

AbdulAlhazred said:

I'd mechanically represent it almost like a revenant, with the primary race overlaid with the special functions of the weapon. 4e should handle this really well.

Click to expand...

That is definitely a route to implementing such and its distinct from the independent/unmerging ones who can readily body hop or like Stormbringer (and maybe Excalibur) and those on the show Soul Eater and other recent fiction who actually have their own separate forms.

Garthanos said:

Elric was arguably not defeated just influenceable and that was what Stormbringer liked in fact arguably Elric's awesomeness influenced Stormbringer to use him as its vehicle.

These weapons are not victims of chance about who picks them up? or who they will fight with? that just isn't the case.

Since they can readily possess a subject transferring themselves to a new more "worthy" one is pretty easy when they find a new worthy one they can further resist someone attempting to pull them from a stone or from a sheath. The ego contest can be as much to find who they can team up with as anything else. Someone who is an abject failure like a minion class character is obviously a stepping stone to better things.

ie remember from the point of view of this artifact and it is as powerful as any artifact with fully heroic ability ... the person controlling them is their weapon even if the control or influence of the superior subject isnt absolute.

Its a bit like do you want someone who can barely do a basic attack each turn.. on your team? You may have 100 percent control of that minion class character but he might not have any real ability worth adding to the set expcept a peasants submission to your will. In fact as a subsumed character he probably would never level.. and its going to be progressively weaker.

Stormbringer wanted a "player" on the stage of history to be wielding it... Excalibur would let none but a king to do so as I said if you want your character to settle for a peasant ummmmmm yeh then you are a peasant among your kind.

Most of the weapons I mentioned are also able to Dance ie they can hover in the air or fly about attacking even not in the grasp of ally.

Stormbringer after the bindings were broken, the Peri from the Invisible war and most all of those on the other sources could also take human form temporarily at least. In the soul eater anime many take that human form and socialize with wielders. Most can be dancing weapons and are attackable directly enticing enemies to attack them not just their wielders and when smashed bleeding magic light (again see Stormbringer for descriptions of a bleeding and screaming magic weapon) -- they are just more potent with a wielder and the wielder is more potent with them.

Mind speach will also being on the racial power list by the way.

Click to expand...

Then again, why would a sword care about who one's parents are, because that is basically what makes a king. What humans do to organize themselves is of little concern to something as alien as an intelligent sword. Would an intelligent sword respect human institutions and customs such as kingship? Just because someone sits on a throne because of who his parents were doesn't not necessarily make him worth to rule a kingdom. You have to remember commoners outnumber monarchs and nobles, statistically among their number, you will find someone who is smarter than any king, and perhaps is a better fighter than any knight, or he has the potential to be such if developed. Feudal customs notwithstanding. The sword has his own ideas. Maybe the sword would like to rule the kingdom, or maybe the sword would like to overthrow it! The problem is, being a sword is sort of like a curse, you need someone else to do anything or to have awareness. A sword without someone to hold it cannot see, it cannot be aware of its surroundings unless it sees through someone else's eyes. If it gets picked up by someone it can't control of steer, then it is at the mercy of that someone. If it is picked up by a low level character, then through adventuring it can share experience points with that adventurer, thus the person advances in a level and so does the sword, and thus the sword's magical bonus increases with each level. The person wielding the sword would advance more slowly, as he is sharing experience points with the sword.

Thomas Bowman said:

The problem is, being a sword is sort of like a curse, you need someone else to do anything or to have awareness. A sword without someone to hold it cannot see

Click to expand...

Who says, shrug as I said reflavor a way gungadin you are talking about a non-character you might as well reflavor a normal player character who talks with his sword.

A sword that can hover and dance ie attacking enemies and attack the one holding it if they do not want to be wielded and so on are not blind, deaf and dumb without possessing someone .. AND these are traits of most of the living weapons from the stories I mentioned even taking humanoid form is not uncommon. Your super dependent smart sword that either is totally in control or totally dependent on the wielder... isnt itself a player character caliber thing in my opinion it is a flavor text.

Thomas Bowman said:

Then again, why would a sword care about who one's parents are, because that is basically what makes a king.

Click to expand...

In myth and legend heros, nobles and kings are of special bloodlines divine or dragons and fey most of the time. Lancelot had a peasant squire that he made ennobled but for every one of those there were over a hundred named characters in those stories who were born to it with magical blood lines that included Dragons, the Fey and Gods and Sun born.

Birth heritage even in reality is one big source of human power (the most obvious now is money but that wasnt the only way). The peasant farmer can get his fancy mostly passive but dependent toy taken by the Nobleman and most of the time it would if you are fond of talking statistical likelihood. Heck the realistic Nobleman probably has better stats because he hasnt been starved and had more opportunity for training heck he likely knows how to use a sword.

Why would a magic sword want to be wielded by someone who doesnt even have training with a weapon? Hanging out with the class who labors the fields isnt their best option.

And an awesome known magical weapon being just left in the mud is not entirely realistic either if that is the idea of your story line.

Thomas Bowman said:

You have to remember commoners outnumber monarchs and nobles, statistically among their number,

Click to expand...

The odds of a given peasant keeping a gold watch they found is pretty low... let alone a fancy sword they do not know how to use.

Additionally are you rolling your backgrounds and playing 1e? In 4e I pick a background and theme ...

That farmer theme was never exciting to me back when i did play 1e.

In the Lord of the Rings we have a fated king, a princeling, an elf and dwarf also of noble lineage and even Frodo was a wealthy landowner the closest his culture had to a nobleman.(he brought his squire as a side kick). The two rogues that accompanied them are the closest to peasants but significantly out numbered.

Thomas Bowman said:

The person wielding the sword would advance more slowly, as he is sharing experience points with the sword.

Click to expand...

Completely inappropriate. If all the weapon is doing is upping its plus bonus its just a reflavor of the normal advancement expected. It isn't providing more benefit to the party than normally expected.