Unearthed Arcana Unearthed Arcana Returns to Monthly With Some Revised Subclasses

I don't like any of these subclasses and consider the Favored Soul two steps back from the prior one (which was one of the few subclasses that I did like).

Mercule said:

If you're going for sorcerer with divine origin, then forcing cure wounds kinda sucks. If your heritage is from the god of pestilence, then why would you have cure wounds? You're "paying for" the ability, in terms of design balance, presumably.

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Maybe. But probably not, as it seems to have been added to Divine Magic. The other 1st level power isn't changed. You are losing the extra hit point, but I imagine that was as much for the balance of not getting three features at level one.
Cure wounds is nice, but you're still limited by spell slots so it's not a huge power increase.

Mercule said:

But, you don't get to use it without running counter to concept.

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Which is fine. If you can play a dragon sorcerer as a buffer rather than DPS you can play a favoured soul that isn't a healbot. And since you still have access to the regular sorcerer spells, you can alternate between healing and blasting.

The existing favoured soul in my game will be very happy with this, as he's playing a Red Mage style character that both heals and drops fireballs. This is one extra spell known.

Mercule said:

I'd rather see them do a sub-origin, like they did with dragon blood. Pick a Cleric domain, get one of the listed 1st level spells for free. Granted, some of them kinda suck, but it at least gives an option for someone who likes the idea of divine blood magic without having to be the healbot. Or, skip the domains and have them pick a "divine nature" that's not perfectly aligned with the domains and grants a bonus spell and a 6th level ability.

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Could work, but much more complicated. And so many cleric domain spells might already be sorcerer spells, so it's just a free bonus spell. And giving that choice adds extra balance concerns: they need to worry about interactions with every existing domain and newly added domain.

ehren37 said:

Dual wielding really needs to be changed to just have the off-hand attack be part of the attack action as part of the fighting style/feat. It solves so many issues.

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Um, you don't need either the feat nor the fighting style to use two-weapon fighting.

Got a rogue who does it. Sure, average 1 point less damage on my on-hand attack because it's a light weapon (but even without Dex-to-damage my off-hand can make that up), but most importantly now I have two opportunities to land a blow and get my sneak attack in for the round. And if I hit on my first attack I can use my bonus action for something else if I want.

Feat isn't particularly enticing with only 1 attack - averages to +1 damage each hand assuming hits, and +1 AC. Multiclassing for fighting style is also not planned anytime in the next few levels. And again, right now it's just to deliver SA - I can skip it any particular round for a different bonus action assuming I hit with the main. If I start investing it it at the cost of my SA, then I'll be more constrained to use it.

I didn't notice anyone else mention this yet, but I really liked the little table showing the subclass abilities by levels. It was nice to see that at a glance.


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Blue said:

Um, you don't need either the feat nor the fighting style to use two-weapon fighting.

Got a rogue who does it. Sure, average 1 point less damage on my on-hand attack because it's a light weapon (but even without Dex-to-damage my off-hand can make that up), but most importantly now I have two opportunities to land a blow and get my sneak attack in for the round. And if I hit on my first attack I can use my bonus action for something else if I want.

Feat isn't particularly enticing with only 1 attack - averages to +1 damage each hand assuming hits, and +1 AC. Multiclassing for fighting style is also not planned anytime in the next few levels. And again, right now it's just to deliver SA - I can skip it any particular round for a different bonus action assuming I hit with the main. If I start investing it it at the cost of my SA, then I'll be more constrained to use it.

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Blue, what they're saying is that the current TWFing rules require you to take a bonus action after using the attack action to make a melee attack. I believe they were saying that the TWFing style should allow you to make your offhand attack as part of your attack action, and not as a bonus action.

Blades don't get shield proficiency, do they?


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Arcane Archer, YaY!!!

Xeviat said:

Blue, what they're saying is that the current TWFing rules require you to take a bonus action after using the attack action to make a melee attack. I believe they were saying that the TWFing style should allow you to make your offhand attack as part of your attack action, and not as a bonus action.

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I'd be fine with that, but the entirety of the post I was replying to was specifically calling out adding it to the fighting style or feat, not just in general. Here's the full quote:

ehren37 said:

Dual wielding really needs to be changed to just have the off-hand attack be part of the attack action as part of the fighting style/feat. It solves so many issues.

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Blue said:

I'd be fine with that, but the entirety of the post I was replying to was specifically calling out adding it to the fighting style or feat, not just in general. Here's the full quote:

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Probably because it being a bonus action has a nice action economy trade off on the Rogue, so they wouldn't want to fully abandon it.


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I like a lot of what was done with these new takes.

Barbarian pretty much is all improved, Clairvoyance on a short rest reminds me of some tribal shaman things I've seen in various media, and protectors just happening on an attack is very very nice. It is the first creature you hit though, so missing ends it. Also, I hadn't considered the shield stacking with the 1/2 damage, that is really good. By the By, 14th level you can reduce 4d8 and then deal 4d8 damage to the enemy, and that damage is untyped which could have interesting implications.


Bard, important thing to note about Blade Flourish is that you don't need to use any of the die special abilities. This means they are constantly getting +10 movement when they use the attack action. Combine that with Mobile for lots of fun and games as a dashing swordsman. I will agree, it should still be an attack and would still activate two-weapon, but I think I may prefer leaving bonus spells up and grabbing dueling instead. I am torn about the use of inspiration, slashing flourish will rarely be a better choice than simply using thunderwave or even thunderclap, and the push of mobile flourish can be entirely wasted by using a battle mat (and honestly, how often is 7 ft vastly different than 5 anyways) but at higher level you could end up pushing 15 ft... which is still kind of a waste.

And that's the worst part of it really, with 2 of the 3 flourishes kind of being crappy, you don't get much for this bard subclass, since all of the abilities revolve around that style. If they were improved, we could have a lot of fun, I like the idea, just not exactly the execution.

Fighter... man, I'm surprised there isn't more hand wringing. Magic arrow combined with archery means that the Fighter is at +3 before dex and prof. A +9 to hit at level 3, that is not bad at all. Lore got nerfed hard for no reason, but I'm fine opening that up for people.

A question about Banishing arrow... why does it specify they have a speed of 0 and are incapped while banished... isn't incapped enough? I don't get that choice in wording.

Piercing arrow and Seeking arrow are interesting, because they take 1/2 damage on a save, including the part where they would get hit with the arrow. Seeking arrow also tells you the targets location after it hits (if they failed) which can be really useful, if they are close by. If not... you still can hit anyone within 600 ft. Man, I want to run a murder mystery with this, where someone is using this ability to kill people with impossible shots. Also, grasping arrow is insanely good now.

Kensei is viable now. I like how the bonus action is to empower ranged attacks, leaving the normal monk bonus action economy to function perfectly fine. This is also now pretty powerful, at higher level you'll be using your monk dice for all damage, so hitting with your fist as part of your attack is fine, meaning you will constantly have +2 AC for no damage loss. And frankly, downgrading your 1d10 to a 1d6 to get +2 AC is not a bad trade.

On reach weapons, there is an interesting route. They specifically call out longbows as weapons you can choose, despite them having the heavy property. It would be possible to have the halberd or guisarme added to that exception list, but that is a very powerful option with 1d10 and reach.

Sharpen the Blade doesn't have to be on the weapon you are wielding, and it also stacks with magic weapons, making this an incredibly powerful ability if the party plans for it. This is also why getting a lot of other weapons for the Kensei might be useful, to convert a magic weapon into your kensei monk weapon.

Favored Soul. I get why people are upset about the forced healing. Makes sense, but it is going to be hard to make this single subclass able to carry the weight of the entire cleric domain system. I'd probably homebrew a lot of this if someone wanted to try it at my table, but I'd also check and see if they didn't just want to play a cleric instead, since the fluffly lore bit fits just as well with any divine chasis and this doesn't offer a lot to my way of looking at things. Plus, sorcerers need a big rewrite anyways IMO. It's nice but my issues with the class and the complaints here make it sound like it isn't quite going to be accepted on a large scale.



Also, why Bard of Blades? That was from quite a long time ago to throw it in. Is it an indication of something?

And I'm a little shocked Sharpshooter was the worst received subclass. I was certain it would be Lore Wizard, but they did rework Lore wizard when they did War wizard, so maybe it didn't count?

Xeviat said:

I didn't notice anyone else mention this yet, but I really liked the little table showing the subclass abilities by levels. It was nice to see that at a glance.


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I hope they stick with this format going forward. It makes the subclasses easier to parse for me.