Players reading DM-only material - Page 2


What's on your mind?

View Poll Results: DMs--what is your opinion about players reading DM-only materials?

Voters
128. You may not vote on this poll
  • It's fine with me--in fact, I encourage them to buy the adventures I'm currently running and read them cover to cover.

    3 2.34%
  • I don't really care one way or the other. Players will do what they'll do

    11 8.59%
  • It's hard to monitor what players read, especially when some are DMs also. I just have to trust them.

    36 28.13%
  • I encourage them not to read the materials and trust that they won't.

    36 28.13%
  • I never use published materials, so it doesn't apply to me.

    18 14.06%
  • I make enough changes to published materials that they'll just screw themselves if they do read them.

    16 12.50%
  • Not in my campaign! *boot*

    6 4.69%
  • Other

    2 1.56%
+ Log in or register to post
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 23
  1. #11
    Registered User
    Novice (Lvl 1)

    SableWyvern's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,057
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore SableWyvern

    Minor Rant

    Perfect timing!

    I awoke this morning (actually, this afternoon) and pretty much first thing my house-mate says, "I read up on Ninja of the Crescent Moon, that's ok isn't it."

    Knowing full well that it wasn't.

    IMC, players know the concept behind the PrCs they're heading for, and most of the pre-reqs, but the rest only comes out in play. This campaign (my first 3e) is probably going to be the only time I can do this effectively - later on, everyone will just know what the PrCs are and their exact capabilities.

    Suffice to say, I was not impressed.

    But, this is an exception to the norm, and my players simply don't read stuff I let them know that they shouldn't.

 

  • #12
    Registered User
    Novice (Lvl 1)

    sotmh's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    70
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore sotmh
    I always give my players the same warning:

    "Published materials that I use to aid the campaign are subject to change without notice in whole or in part. I encourage you to avoid reading those sections that are clearly marked for the GM as it may lessen your enjoyment of the game."

    Of course, I've had players ignore this warning and read GM material anyway. I used to get angry, but now I just continue on as if they hadn't read anything. I see no reason to change my plans simply because somebody wants to read the last page of the book first (so to speak). It's just too much bother and work and stress to worry about what my players read, so if they do it's just too bad for them when they're not surprised by the twist ending.

    Now if they let that knowledge affect their in-game play, then I get nasty and change stuff. Since I mostly improvise, this is quite easy and I feel perfectly justified in changing the nature of the world and NPCs on the fly if I feel this is happening. So far, my players have been good, but I know who among them reads the little secrets, so I know who I have to keep an eye on.

    sotmh
    "They called me mad, and I called them mad, and damn them, they outvoted me." Nathaniel Lee (on being consigned to a mental institution, circa 17th c.)

  • #13
    How do you handle playerDMs? I'm one, I have a couple in one my game too. People who both DM and play. If a DM tried to tell me "You can't read through the MM (I've known DMs who "forbid" their players to read the MM... outside games, that is, I can understand during a game...), I would have to leave... I have to be able to read that type of stuff. Likewise, I read modules and dungeon magazines looking for ideas. Because I am a DM I'm never supposed to get to play again?

    If a DM said to me, "Hey, Dave, I'm running the adventure on page #97 of January's "Dungeon", could you not read it for a while?" I'd probably agree if I hadn't already, out of decency... but what am I supposed to do if I've already read it? Stop gaming untill the group finishes that session?

  • #14
    WotC's bitch COPPER SUBSCRIBER
    Scout (Lvl 6)

    hong's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    19,381
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore hong
    My communities:

    Re: Minor Rant

    Originally posted by SableWyvern
    Perfect timing!

    I awoke this morning (actually, this afternoon) and pretty much first thing my house-mate says, "I read up on Ninja of the Crescent Moon, that's ok isn't it."

    Knowing full well that it wasn't.
    ??? There's nothing about the various class splatbooks that I'd consider to be DM-only material.

  • #15
    lunatic COPPER SUBSCRIBER
    Novice (Lvl 1)

    Berandor's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Essen, Germany
    Posts
    2,757
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore Berandor
    My communities:

    Well, I don't use published adventeures most of the time I'm playing...

    My players aren't allowed to read other than the PH during game, plus relevant information on their characters (if they've got a spell from Tome&Blood, they can read up on it).

    However, when I notice that DM knowledge is used like "the troll can't regenerate fire and acid", when they've never encountered a troll, then I change my minions... the troll suddenly can't regenrate cold and electricity, but fire and acid is no problem.
    It's a "Storm Troll".

    Bad Luck.

    Berandor
    Last edited by Berandor; Sunday, 3rd March, 2002 at 01:11 PM.
    P-Pricken.de

    "I desperately needed to go throw up, but I was so busy reading your story I made myself wait until I was done reading it" Sialia

    Read my stories (PDF):
    Gwen / One Hour Later, Three Days Ago / Cold Fish / Indian Summer / Disillusionment / Rememberance / For Lack of a Better Term / The Hunt / The Second Coming (AU-Serial)
    "Berandor, what a beautiful story. It made me cry at the end." Eeralai on "Rememberance"

    Disclaimer 1: Above all, I am a very silly man. So if a statement of mine can be construed as joke - especially if it's not funny - it likely is.
    Disclaimer 2: I am also opinionated, so when not joking I am still voicing my opinion. Except when I am stating facts.

  • #16
    Grrr. The "troll example". I've always hated it.

    Does no fantasy world have "common knowledge"? I mean, heck... Vampires aren't real, nor are werewolves, or several other supernatural things... but tons of people still "know how to kill them". Stories get around, legends of "Arkdash the Troll Slayer and his Flaming Sword", stuff like that.

  • #17
    Registered User
    Waghalter (Lvl 7)



    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Posts
    3,727
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore rounser
    I agree Tsyr. In places like the Forgotten Realms, where they have places named after trollslayers (like Daggerford), are commoners really not going to remember an important little detail like "to kill a troll, you have to burn them or they'll get back up again"? Are they really going to be surprised when a wizard starts hurling magic missiles and fireballs, two of the most common combat spells for hundreds of years? Or when they realise that orcs can see in the dark?

    Nope. They probably won't know much about the rarer-than-common spells or monsters or obscure abilities though - the line on their knowledge should indeed be drawn somewhere, but not there. It's actually unrealistic to do so, IMO. Characters in the average D&D world live in a world overflowing with monsters and magic, give them some credit for that.
    Last edited by rounser; Sunday, 3rd March, 2002 at 01:51 PM.

  • #18
    Originally posted by Darkness
    Heh. A pity that this isn't a multiple-choice poll.

    All of the following applies to me:

    I encourage them not to read the materials and trust that they won't.

    I make enough changes to published materials that they'll just screw themselves if they do read them.

    Not in my campaign! *boot*




    It's the first of these three, though.
    I agree with this as well, with a heavy dash of "I don't care thrown it."

  • #19
    Registered User
    Novice (Lvl 1)

    SableWyvern's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,057
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore SableWyvern

    Re: Re: Minor Rant

    Originally posted by hong


    ??? There's nothing about the various class splatbooks that I'd consider to be DM-only material.
    Unless the DM specifically designates it so, which is what I have done.

    I wanted PrCs in this campaign to be character concepts that the players strive for, rather than mechanics-bonuses.

    By gaining a thorough knowledge of the players' desires, and diseminating a minimum of information, I have been able to work with the players to determine PrCs that fit into their character concept, without having mechanics become an issue.

    Frex, once player has a demon hating ranger who is heading for Knight of the Chalice. The player knew that they were a demon-hunting PrC with a few spells, as well as the PrC's feat, bab and skill requirements. Last session, he met a KotC, and his character learnt of the organisations existence. He was informed that he would need to improve his swordsmanship, personally vanquish a demon, quest for enchanted plate and learn to chanel positive energy before he would be accepted into the order. When he meets the pre-reqs and becomes a KotC, their special abilities will be revealed to him, etc, etc.

    The player who decided to read up on the Ninja, knowing that that was not allowed, has spoiled some of the mystique that I have been able to provide PrCs in this particular campaign. He himself admitted that his mischief had spoiled the surprise.

  • #20
    Clockwork Golem COPPER SUBSCRIBER
    Novice (Lvl 1)

    arwink's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Norman Park, QLD
    Posts
    3,199
    Reviews
    Read 0 Reviews

    Ignore arwink
    My communities:

    I'm somewhere between option b and option c, but probably a tad closer to b. I used to be really intense about what my players could and couldn't read, but at the time I was the only DM and most of the players made no effort to get any game stuff unless it was to gain some kind of advantage. Over the past few years I've just ceased caring, largely due to a new group of players, another DM to alternate sessions with and a number of players taking responsibility for learning the rules onto themselves, rather than relying on me to teach them. The only thing I'm even remotely worried about anymore is adventures, and given that the other DM runes planescape and my games take place in my messed up little world, there's really very little overlap there. I think one dungeon mag in about three years, something like that.

    There's a lot of stuff out there. It's easy to avoid stepping on your co-DM's toes these days.
    Peter M. Ball

  • + Log in or register to post
    Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

    Similar Threads

    1. Why is the material relam even important? ( reading about planes )
      By dionysis in forum Older D&D Editions and OSR Gaming
      Replies: 10
      Last Post: Sunday, 1st November, 2009, 03:50 PM
    2. Overwhelmed, please help with reading material.
      By Wobber in forum Story Hour
      Replies: 17
      Last Post: Sunday, 23rd November, 2008, 11:33 PM
    3. Teachers suggest some reading material
      By Starman in forum Miscellaneous Geek Talk & Media Lounge
      Replies: 11
      Last Post: Tuesday, 18th July, 2006, 12:39 AM
    4. [OT] SciFi/Fantasy reading material suggestions?
      By Undead Pete in forum Miscellaneous Geek Talk & Media Lounge
      Replies: 36
      Last Post: Tuesday, 2nd July, 2002, 11:14 AM
    5. [OT] SciFi/Fantasy reading material suggestions?
      By Undead Pete in forum General RPG Discussion
      Replies: 25
      Last Post: Tuesday, 25th June, 2002, 12:43 AM

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •