Help me build a Sorcerer

Caspian

First Post
Its my first time playing a high level D&D game of any sort and while I have a handle on the rules I don't really have all of 3.5 at the ready nor the magic user inclination. However I'm slotted to play a 15th level sorcerer. (28 point buy)

My problem is that I have no real clue how to stack it. I was thinking of playing an elven sorcerer who kinda specializes in summoning, but apart from the fact I think I can push my Charisma up to about 21 with a cloak of charisma +6, I don't know much else.


My thoughts so far:

Earmark CON, DEX and WIS and CHA for the other points, leave the other stats at 10?

the Augment Summoning feat from Tome and Blood (does/can that stack?)

A seeking Longbow and some funky arrows



Jonathan
 

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Chun-tzu

First Post
So is it a 3e game or 3.5? What books are you allowed access to?

Summoning is considered by many to be subpar in 3e (don't know if it's changed in 3.5). You pretty much need a summoning prestige class to make it work.
 

Caspian

First Post
Oh, doh.

3.5 game, access to... er, don't know the limits, I'm assuming WoTC books, haven't bought the quintessential sorcerer yet. Its Psi-severed head running the game if that means anything and I'm worried if I don't stack, the party will all die horrible flaming deaths :p


If summoning isn't good, er what is? I assume I have to do offense a bit as well as buffing.



Jonathan
 

Grog

First Post
Honestly, if this is your first time playing high-level D&D, I would strongly advise against playing a spellcaster. See if you can play a fighter or rogue instead. It'll be beneficial for you, because you won't feel as overwhelmed, and it'll be beneficial for the group, because they won't have to sit and wait while you try and get a grasp on your spells and what they do.

If you're absolutely locked into playing a sorceror, make sure you pick your spells carefully. You don't get many, and you don't want to be stuck with a bunch of marginally useful spells. 3.5 made things a lot worse for sorcerors because they split a bunch of spells up into multiple spells.

Other than that, I don't really know enough about 3.5 to help you very much. I do know that spellcasters got powered down a lot, though.
 

Chun-tzu

First Post
If you want to maximize effectiveness, then the most important thing is to choose your spells wisely. You want to choose spells that are effective, and that can cover multiple functions. Sorcerers work well as battle mages and illusionists, possibly enchanters, and one or two other roles that I'm forgetting.

If you want to go for a prestige class, then you need to build your character around it. As a sorcerer, you have little to lose by taking a prestige class, so you may as well.

However, spells have changed quite a bit in 3.5. They've made it harder for the sorcerer, by splitting up some of the multifunction spells, like Emotion. Buffing has also changed significantly, so it's not a "must-have" function of a sorcerer anymore. I can't offer a lot of advice on choosing spells in 3.5, since I don't have the revised books yet.
 


I play a Kobold Sorceror (8th level) now under 3.0 + house rules (most charisma based skills are class skill, including Use Magic Device, and I get 4 base skill points. But spells and so are the same)

When I choose spells, I made sure that I had a damage dealing spell on nearly every level, and that (in the long run at least) I have access to every kind of energy. (Magic Missile for force - which is probably no kind of energy, but who cares? - Melfs Acid Arrow for Acid, Fireball for fire, sonic orb for sonic, cone of cold is on my list for cold, and prismatic spray for anything that might be missing :) ).
Then I took some defensive spells:
Then I took Cat`s Grace (good for my ranged touch attack and Armor Class), Expeditious retreat (Kobolds need it, in case of emergencies), Mage Armor and Shield. (Probably one or two spells are missing in this list).
The next are utility spells:
Haste: It will be useful either in 3 or in 3.5 - in 3 I have the problem I do not always want to waste my precious spells (a sorceror doesn´t have that much more spells per day than a specialist wizard - probably 2 per spell level), but sometimes an ally might need it - in this case, the 3.5 version is superior, since every ally gains his benefits from it.
Detect Thoughts (since Sense Motive isn`t a class skill for my sorceror).
I consider Alter Self (maybe someone doesn`t trust Kobolds? And water breathing or cheap flying might be a good idea), especially since I do not want to learn Polymorph Self/Other.
I will learn fly and Arcane Sight (Tome & Blood, I believe). Fly is always useful, and Arcane Sight allows me to see magical auras without concentrating, so I can instantly see invisible creatures (I know, See Invisibility would be a good alternative, but seeing magic auras gives some other benefits)

My general advice:
First, look for damage dealing spells on each spell level, if possible. In most combats, you have no other way in contributing.

Second, look for good defensive spells, not neccesarily at each spell level, but you should have some basic ones. (Mage Armor, Shield is the obvious choice. Protection from Arrows, Wall of Force and so on might also be useful)

Third, use spells that fit your theme, or spells that have multiple purpose (like Alter Self/Polymorph, Shadow spells, perhaps even Prismatic Spray/wall, but also Charm Person/Monster, Dominate and so on)

For Summoning spells: The lower level ones are mostly useless at high levels. Check if you can find a level that grants you access to a monster that has spellike abilities or spells that you don`t have (maybe healing spells, like the unicorn). (If you summon 6 (?) Formian Workers, you can get a Heal Spell...)

Mustrum Ridcully
 

Qvintus

First Post
My advise is to find a theam for you char like i am the master of the lower plans so you summon fiendish animals and take spell the the fiends have darkness, charm person and sugerstion and otherwise rename you spell's into that theam like i you have magic misile you call it stings of the imp. Or anoughter theam it gives a mushe more fun char :)
 

Li Shenron

Legend
I would like to try a straightforward summoner who relies almost completely on his summoned creatures and tries not to get involved in the battle directly.

At level 15th you know this many spells: 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 2 — —

Apart from cantrips, you could obviously have all the Summon Monster I-VII and Planar Binding and let's see what else could you use to support your summoned creature... please someone check out from this list the spells which won't work on outsiders or summoned creatures or work only on self, because I really don't remember!

1st
Enlarge
Mage Armor
Magic Weapon
Protection from C/E/G/L
2nd
Protection from Arrows
Resist Elements
Darkness *
Blur
Bull's Strength
Cat's Grace
Endurance
3rd
Magic Circle etc.
Displacement
Invisibility Sphere
Haste (3.5)
4th
Improved Invisibility

Otherwise, a bunch of defensive spells for yourself, mostly to keep you out of the action:

1st
Expeditious Retreat
Obscuring Mist
Spider Climb
2nd
Fog Cloud
Invisibility
Levitate
Rope Trick
3rd
Blink
Fly
Gaseous Form
4th
Dimension Door
5th
Wall of Force
Teleport
6th
Repulsion

And some other spells that are not all exactly summoning but fit with the theme:

1st
Mount
Unseen Servant
2nd
Summon Swarm
3rd
Phantom Steed
4th
Evard's Black Tentacles
5th
MK's Faithful Hound

* An interesting tactic could be to summon Devils and cast Darkness on the battlefield.

It would be interesting to try if this summoner could cast 3-4 summoning per encounter, some with more but lesser outsiders at the same time, for a total of 5-8 creatures, then spend the rest of the encounter to buff them up or replace killed ones.

My biggest concerns would be probably:
1) area dispelling may waste the whole summoned party quickly
2) SM spells are always full-round casting
3) there's not much time to cast protective spells on self

I don't know how to improve 1). For 2) a good Concentration score would be useful, and 3) may suggest to invest in Extend Spell and Persistent Spell. Or Permanency. Even better if the DM allows Sorcs to use Quicken Spell on spells with casting time longer than 1 action, for the 1st summoning only.

What's strange about such a character is that if he could manage to let summoned creatures fight for him, he would not need high ability scores at all. Not even Charisma, since he would be casting spells with no or harmless ST. I'd go with CON and DEX as high as possible, to improve also Concentration and Initiative.

Helpful Feats are very few. Augment Summoning is 100% obvious, maybe Improved Initiative (you really want your first summoned to appear as soon as possible) and anything that you may find to lower the chances of dispelling. At 15th level summoning duration couldn't be any better.
 

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