Jeff_M_Stone
First Post
I'm not sure if geomancer would work as well as you'd hope, it might be good as some kind of result of a cross class Monk/Druid or something. Or it could possibly be instead of Druid?
[FFD20] Let's Mass our Forces, and Rebuild our Power
GnomeWorks
Adventurer
Well, I know that you're currently working on the six 'core classes' atm, but I'm going to throw in my 2 gil, which will primarily concern the more... unusual classes...
FF is FF because of a wide variety of things. Chocobos, summoners with horns... as FF players, we all understand what these are.
Chocobos are relatively easy. I worked out a statblock for yellow chocobos in around 15 minutes.
That brings me to my next point... summoners. Using summoning magic, regardless of which particular system is used, will be rather difficult. Admittedly, something as simple as using a variant of summon monster spells would be alright, but I don't know if that quite fits. Not only that, most of the 'common' summoned monsters aren't run-of-the-mill critters... some are, such as the chocobo summon from FFIV, but others, such as Shiva, are a little more unusual and will require more work.
And the blue mage, which is also based off of monsters. In the past, I have attempted to create a blue mage-like class for DnD. It doesn't work. Monster abilities are generally either too wierd to use for blue magic, or emulate spells. While blue magic does generally end up emulating normal magic, in some cases, it doesn't... imo, a blue mage class in FFT would've been an excellent idea, as there are a wide variety of monster abilities that other magic types simply lack.
There are a few other classes that will be difficult... but I don't think that most will be as difficult as these two will be.
Oh, and if you happen to need someone to stat up either of those classes, or anything else, for that matter... well, I am available...
FF is FF because of a wide variety of things. Chocobos, summoners with horns... as FF players, we all understand what these are.
Chocobos are relatively easy. I worked out a statblock for yellow chocobos in around 15 minutes.
That brings me to my next point... summoners. Using summoning magic, regardless of which particular system is used, will be rather difficult. Admittedly, something as simple as using a variant of summon monster spells would be alright, but I don't know if that quite fits. Not only that, most of the 'common' summoned monsters aren't run-of-the-mill critters... some are, such as the chocobo summon from FFIV, but others, such as Shiva, are a little more unusual and will require more work.
And the blue mage, which is also based off of monsters. In the past, I have attempted to create a blue mage-like class for DnD. It doesn't work. Monster abilities are generally either too wierd to use for blue magic, or emulate spells. While blue magic does generally end up emulating normal magic, in some cases, it doesn't... imo, a blue mage class in FFT would've been an excellent idea, as there are a wide variety of monster abilities that other magic types simply lack.
There are a few other classes that will be difficult... but I don't think that most will be as difficult as these two will be.
Oh, and if you happen to need someone to stat up either of those classes, or anything else, for that matter... well, I am available...
Drake Masters
First Post
Core Classess
Well, if we are using the core classess that Pengin suggested, I offer to help with any of the Mages, and the knight.
Well, if we are using the core classess that Pengin suggested, I offer to help with any of the Mages, and the knight.
Jeff_M_Stone
First Post
Blue Mages
I dunno, I think a blue Mage could work, I think maybe we'd have to do it the way they did it in FFX, with Khimari's lancet ability. Just so the Blue mage can have a skill that he can use at low levels to get Blue Magic spells. Generally a blue mage has fairly weak magic too, so a blue mage might have to be tweaked to be a slightly better fighter than say a black mage
I dunno, I think a blue Mage could work, I think maybe we'd have to do it the way they did it in FFX, with Khimari's lancet ability. Just so the Blue mage can have a skill that he can use at low levels to get Blue Magic spells. Generally a blue mage has fairly weak magic too, so a blue mage might have to be tweaked to be a slightly better fighter than say a black mage
I did some work on the mages last night (though I won't get back to them until the weekend; tonight's tabletop D&D night). The basic system is based on D&D psionics (power points => MP, powers => spells, etc.), with a few tweaks (there's some caster level dependency in the spells; nowhere near as much as in D&D magic, but more than D&D psi).
As an example, here's the Fire spell sequence
Fire, Lesser
[Fire]
Level: Black 1
Range: Close
Target: One creature or object
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +5).
Fire, Lesser Mass
[Fire]
Level: Black 2
Range: Close
Target: One creature/2 levels
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +5) to each target.
Fire
[Fire]
Level: Black 3
Range: Medium
Target: One creature or object
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 5d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +10).
Fire, Mass
[Fire]
Level: Black 4
Range: Medium
Target: One creature/2 levels
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 5d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +10) to each target.
Fire, Greater
[Fire]
Level: Black 5
Range: Long
Target: One creature or object
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 9d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +15).
Fire, Greater Mass
[Fire]
Level: Black 6
Range: Long
Target: One creature/2 levels
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 9d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +15) to each target.
As an example, here's the Fire spell sequence
Fire, Lesser
[Fire]
Level: Black 1
Range: Close
Target: One creature or object
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +5).
Fire, Lesser Mass
[Fire]
Level: Black 2
Range: Close
Target: One creature/2 levels
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +5) to each target.
Fire
[Fire]
Level: Black 3
Range: Medium
Target: One creature or object
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 5d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +10).
Fire, Mass
[Fire]
Level: Black 4
Range: Medium
Target: One creature/2 levels
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 5d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +10) to each target.
Fire, Greater
[Fire]
Level: Black 5
Range: Long
Target: One creature or object
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 9d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +15).
Fire, Greater Mass
[Fire]
Level: Black 6
Range: Long
Target: One creature/2 levels
Save: Ref 1/2
Deals 9d4 points of fire damage + 1 point of fire damage per caster level (maximum of +15) to each target.
Psychotic Jim
First Post
On the subject of classes, if you wanted to keep the list down to a few basic ones, an option might be to make specific feat chains to represent various different character abilities within the same general area of expertise, such as Sabin's Blitzes or Cyan's SwordTechs. I also think the earlier suggestion about using specific talent trees like in d20Modern might be a good alternative as well. A set of "sub-classes" within each general class could be done too, like how the psion has several (telepath, egoist, etc.), each with slightly different abilities and class skills.
Another option is to make some sort of hybrid of the d20 base system and some sort of point buy system where you would buy individual powers/advantages seperately, like Guardian of Order's Anime d20 SRD.
About spells, the question needs to be asked on how are they going to be learned and cast? The video game structure tend to support something like a mana-based sorceror spontaneously casting spells and learning specific ones as a character levels up. If a class-based system, like the black mage vs. white mage structure, is set up, will the traditional D&D definition of arcane/wizard magic and divine/clerical magic still be upheld? Where does it leave grey magic (Scan, Osmose, ect.)? Certainly, a esper/materia supplement created down the line might require a total reconstruction of a class-based magic system.
Another option is to make some sort of hybrid of the d20 base system and some sort of point buy system where you would buy individual powers/advantages seperately, like Guardian of Order's Anime d20 SRD.
About spells, the question needs to be asked on how are they going to be learned and cast? The video game structure tend to support something like a mana-based sorceror spontaneously casting spells and learning specific ones as a character levels up. If a class-based system, like the black mage vs. white mage structure, is set up, will the traditional D&D definition of arcane/wizard magic and divine/clerical magic still be upheld? Where does it leave grey magic (Scan, Osmose, ect.)? Certainly, a esper/materia supplement created down the line might require a total reconstruction of a class-based magic system.
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Pengin
First Post
Magic...
Let's see, we have three magic topics here:
Summons - With summons I'd just assume make them as spells. Eg. Shiva is a 3rd level spell that only a certain class (maybe we'll call it Summoner) can get. It'd do a bunch of ice damage to a certain area or something. The only problem is most of the summons in FF do damage and little else. I think all of Carbunkles modifications from FFIX would be awesome as summons and help to make them viable characters.
Then again, Carbunkle is my favorite summon ever.
Blue Magic - Blue Magic in d20 suffers because you usually don't fight as many monsters and therefore not as much of a variety of monsters. Maybe Blue Mages could randomly pick up monster abilities with levels and still being able to learn a certain amount in addition to that. Certainly the class would need a lot of playing around with.
Speaking of Blue Magic and Summons together does anyone remember how in FFIV you could learn to summon any monster after killing it a bunch? I think it's impractical to put into a game system but it would be pretty cool if we could.
Fire spells up for perusal - Pretty solid. Really, Fire, Ice, and Thunder are basic concepts as far as spells go. Make whatever you want to die explode into tiny fragments. When I did these spells I used d12s (though less of them) because you never see enough d12s. I think as long as we stay away from d6s we'll be doing good, though. I mean Fireball is so overdone. And Lightning Bolt.
Also, requiring people to have lots of d4s fills me with a strange and unexplainable sense of joy.
As an aside I think to make the game world have more of a certain flavor and feel it'd be best to avoid using many D&D spells. D&D spells make the game world feel like D&D. FF spells make the game world feel like FF, right? Right.
-Karl
Let's see, we have three magic topics here:
Summons - With summons I'd just assume make them as spells. Eg. Shiva is a 3rd level spell that only a certain class (maybe we'll call it Summoner) can get. It'd do a bunch of ice damage to a certain area or something. The only problem is most of the summons in FF do damage and little else. I think all of Carbunkles modifications from FFIX would be awesome as summons and help to make them viable characters.
Then again, Carbunkle is my favorite summon ever.
Blue Magic - Blue Magic in d20 suffers because you usually don't fight as many monsters and therefore not as much of a variety of monsters. Maybe Blue Mages could randomly pick up monster abilities with levels and still being able to learn a certain amount in addition to that. Certainly the class would need a lot of playing around with.
Speaking of Blue Magic and Summons together does anyone remember how in FFIV you could learn to summon any monster after killing it a bunch? I think it's impractical to put into a game system but it would be pretty cool if we could.
Fire spells up for perusal - Pretty solid. Really, Fire, Ice, and Thunder are basic concepts as far as spells go. Make whatever you want to die explode into tiny fragments. When I did these spells I used d12s (though less of them) because you never see enough d12s. I think as long as we stay away from d6s we'll be doing good, though. I mean Fireball is so overdone. And Lightning Bolt.
Also, requiring people to have lots of d4s fills me with a strange and unexplainable sense of joy.
As an aside I think to make the game world have more of a certain flavor and feel it'd be best to avoid using many D&D spells. D&D spells make the game world feel like D&D. FF spells make the game world feel like FF, right? Right.
-Karl
Reporting for Duty!
Hiya, ladies and gentlemen.
I'm reporting in with my observations, requests, and thoughts.
Observations: We lack organization. We're brainstorming some *great* ideas, but alot of them are being lost in the maelstrom.
Requests: I'd like to work on the Core Character Classes and Feats. Also, if possible, I'd like to get a seat on the Art Wagon.
Thoughts: I took the core classes creamysteak proposed and ran with them. I put my thoughts as to how they should be represented in d20. They are located at the following website, for space conservation's sake:
http://www.prism.gatech.edu/~gte750u/FFD20/Core_Feats.html
Hiya, ladies and gentlemen.
I'm reporting in with my observations, requests, and thoughts.
Observations: We lack organization. We're brainstorming some *great* ideas, but alot of them are being lost in the maelstrom.
Requests: I'd like to work on the Core Character Classes and Feats. Also, if possible, I'd like to get a seat on the Art Wagon.
Thoughts: I took the core classes creamysteak proposed and ran with them. I put my thoughts as to how they should be represented in d20. They are located at the following website, for space conservation's sake:
http://www.prism.gatech.edu/~gte750u/FFD20/Core_Feats.html
Pengin
First Post
Classes...
DimTye's Classes: Most of them look pretty good except that the Red Mage gets no good saves and a d4 hit die. Though along with that he gets some all right proficiencies and decent skills. I think his hit die needs to be higher, probably d6, and that he should be able to cast some spells in light armor with no arcane failure (not unlike the D&D Bard.)
It would be all right to have a d4 hit dice if he got good spells but he is posted he only gets up to 5th level spells, which is a pretty harsh limitation. Maybe 7th would be better. I still think the d4 hit die isn't very condusive to the Red Mage's combat suvivability. In FFI he was able to stay on the front line along with the fighter so hit points would be good.
And, as a general rule, ever character class should have at least one good save, IMHO.
-Karl
DimTye's Classes: Most of them look pretty good except that the Red Mage gets no good saves and a d4 hit die. Though along with that he gets some all right proficiencies and decent skills. I think his hit die needs to be higher, probably d6, and that he should be able to cast some spells in light armor with no arcane failure (not unlike the D&D Bard.)
It would be all right to have a d4 hit dice if he got good spells but he is posted he only gets up to 5th level spells, which is a pretty harsh limitation. Maybe 7th would be better. I still think the d4 hit die isn't very condusive to the Red Mage's combat suvivability. In FFI he was able to stay on the front line along with the fighter so hit points would be good.
And, as a general rule, ever character class should have at least one good save, IMHO.
-Karl
Well, here's what I've got for the mages, in very early form; all I've got for spells right now are the elemental attack spells and the cure spells.
http://home.san.rr.com/drothgery/ff_magic_users.doc
http://home.san.rr.com/drothgery/ff_magic_users.doc
