D&D 5E Mystic playtest...ugg this class is all over the place

GMforPowergamers · Oct 23, 2017

Xeviat said:
I think the only failing in the Mystic now (aside from some individual power imbalances) is that they made it a long rest recovery class and not a short rest recovery class. With points, it’s too easy to blow through them all in a few rounds when a day is likely going to be 3-8 encounters by the balance guidelines. Had they cut the points by a 3rd and made them recover on a short rest, it would require spreading things out so these ultimate novas wouldn’t happen.

You also touch on something interesting. I think the number of disciplines you can learn outside of your focus should be smaller. This way, you don’t have someone who’s a little Cleric, Fighter, and Mage in one.

Yes, a few imbalance (like making a +3 weapon) and a bit more restrictions on powers you can take would sure up the class a lot.

Guest 6801328 · Oct 23, 2017

Let him roll his opponents' saving throws and see if that shuts him up.

Yaarel · Oct 23, 2017

"Psychic healers" are a thing.

They have psychometabolic control of the body to heal.
They have affinity with the aura of the soul.
They can telepathically contact a distant mind of the spirit and the being of the consciousness.

Raise Dead makes sense to me.

Yaarel · Oct 23, 2017

A Level 1 Cleric can effectively create three +3 magic weapons. By casting Bless for +1d4 attacks ( ≈ +2.5).

I feel Bless is too powerful for Level 1 within bounded accuracy. It outclasses the Magic Weapon spell at +1, only one.

Magic Weapon becomes +2 at Level 7, and +3 at Level 11.

In this context, Bless with +2.5 deserves to become available at Level 7 (spell level 4).

The Mystic +3 should probably come online around Level 11.

Yaarel · Oct 23, 2017

Xeviat said:
I think the only failing in the Mystic now (aside from some individual power imbalances) is that they made it a long rest recovery class and not a short rest recovery class. With points, it’s too easy to blow through them all in a few rounds when a day is likely going to be 3-8 encounters by the balance guidelines. Had they cut the points by a 3rd and made them recover on a short rest, it would require spreading things out so these ultimate novas wouldn’t happen.

You also touch on something interesting. I think the number of disciplines you can learn outside of your focus should be smaller. This way, you don’t have someone who’s a little Cleric, Fighter, and Mage in one.

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Mystic as a ‘short rest’ ‘psionic wizard’, works best. The short rest refresh helps the Mystic feel different from a Wizard.

I like focusing on one or two themes. I wish the Wizard would too. But for the Mystic, the psionic flavor makes a thematic focus more important.

My concern is, the player should be customizing the theme, not the design locking away options and forcing aweful unwanted choices into the mix.

The best approach is for the player and the DM to agree on which choice fit together as part of an overall theme. I am unsure how mechanics can achieve this.

Inchoroi · Oct 23, 2017

I really want to like Mystic...but it is all over the place thematically. To me, Mystic should be weird, not be able to do everything every other class can do, almost as well. To me, the basic theme for Mystic should be: "Mind Over...", while there should be three subclasses, "Matter", "Mind", and "Space". It depresses me that Wu Jen can be a better Four Elements Monk than a Four Elements Monk.

Krachek · Oct 23, 2017

Playtest material.
Since it did not make Xanathar guide, it's going to be playtest for a least 2 years before having an official revision.
Take your pen and eraser and start to work.

Yaarel · Oct 23, 2017

Themes that I want to see.

Telepathy (Communicate, Charm, Fear, Suggestion, Domination, Phantasm, Hallucination)
Force (Telekinesis, Fly, Magic Missile, Shield, Force, Radiant, Light, Force Constructs)
Prescience-Teleport (Esp/Divinate/Predict; Clairvoyance, Outofbody Projection, Teleport, Time Manipulation, bring body where mind is)
Shapeshift-Healing (Psychometabolism, Healing, Polymorph, Poison, Acid)
Elementalism (Fire/Lightning, Water/Cold, Air/Thunder/Plants, Earth/Crystal/Metal/Bludgeon/Pierce/Slash)

I think it is fair. The highest level powers can only come from ones chosen theme. Powers from other themes must be available later from powers that are lower than ones highest level. (To be clearer what I mean. Say a Wizard focuses on Elementalism. When reaching the 3rd spell level, the Wizard can only choose elemental 3rd spell level spells, such as Fireball. However, at the same time, now non-elemental 2nd spell level spells become available.)

Also, there can be archetypes within archetypes. For example, an elementalist might focus especially on Fire. A Prescient might focus on predicting the future and time travel. And so on.

‘Plants’ equates to Air, within Daoist alchemy. Air moves like a Tree. The five Daoist elements are fundamental motions, not substances: things that move up like Fire, move down like Water, contract into denseness like Metal, expand all encompassing like Tree, and supply space like Soil. Plants generate oxygen, so there is affinity between Air and Tree for other reasons too. In other cultures, the cosmic tree is the sky planted on the land, whose whose canopy of branches are the clouds and stars. Soil corresponds to Ether, but Soil is mostly understood as the empty space of Void, vacuum, and outer space.

GMforPowergamers · Oct 23, 2017

Yaarel said:
"Psychic healers" are a thing.

They have psychometabolic control of the body to heal.
They have affinity with the aura of the soul.
They can telepathically contact a distant mind of the spirit and the being of the consciousness.

Raise Dead makes sense to me.

I will disagree here. I think self only healing through pschometabolic is perfect, healing others should be harder, but I can see it on living targets (Undead and constructs not so much). bringing out of a comma with psi surgery maybe...but back from the dead is a step too far for me.

Yaarel said:
A Level 1 Cleric can effectively create three +3 magic weapons. By casting Bless for +1d4 attacks ( ≈ +2.5). No concentration!

+1d4 to hit is much weaker then +3 to hit and damage.

I feel Bless is too powerful for Level 1 within bounded accuracy.

I go back and forth on this one, but I wont argue your wrong.

Bless deserves to become available at Level 7 (spell level 4).

The Mystic +3 should probably come online around Level 9.

mystic magic weapons should be +1 at 3rdish level, +2 at 9thish level and +3 at 13thish level... maybe varie a bit by 1 or 2 levels...but +3 at 1st level is way overboard.