Bizarro World History 101: Monster Origins

Thanks for all of the feedback, guys. I didn't really expect it to take off like this.

Now, onto individual monsters
Hmm... apparently I was looking at the wrong illustration on the ahuizotl. Thanks for pointing that out. I'll edit it.

Andrew Gable, thanks for the wyrg tip. Probably explains both where Tolkien got the name and how TSR got away with it. Also, the gnoll reference comes from an interview with Gygax that was one of the threads on this board, although Dunasay might have been a subconcious influence (Dunusay's depictions of fantasy lands and the Faerie court were also probably DnD influences). And yes, I did simplify the lamia a little. This will also be edited. Also, I have heard reference to Chysaor before, but only in passing. What was it (other than a flying horse)? What was Pegasus then? And was that "we'll let that pass" statement a subtle reference to you being a group entity?

I hadn't heard of the Hungarian tie to ogres before. Interesting... My source for the orc connection was the book Giants, Monsters and Dragons, which was my biggest source for this info. Also an excellent book.

Demiurge out.

Grim said:

Now, the monsters I really want to know the origion of are the ones from Lewis Carrol's Poems, the Jabberwock, the bandersnatch, the snark and the boojum.

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Drugs?

I don't know. I've got an annotated copy of Snark here, and it's got an excerpt from Carroll's last comment on the Snark, written in 1897:

"In answer to your question, 'What did you mean the Snark was?' will you tell your friend that I meant that the Snark was a Boojum. I trust that she and you will now feel quite satisfied and happy."

In general, Carroll denied any knowledge of meaning in The Hunting Of The Snark and was quite surprised by people who nevertheless found some. That, of course, doesn't stop people making pages and pages of annotations to try to reason out the actual meaning of a pig on trial for deserting its sty.

There are two Carroll-associated images of the Snark by one Holliday, whose engravings gifted the first editions of the nonsense epic. In the last engraving in the book, the Bellman rings his bell before a dark valley and a tree. If you look at the tree and the contours of the valley closely, you can discern the face of the Baker and something siezing hold of his wrist - it's described as variably a claw or a beak. Needless to say, the Baker doesn't look happy in his ghostly last appearance.

The second illustration was no-noed by Carroll, largely because it actually depicted the Snark/Boojum. It's since resurfaced, and features a seal-elephant-thing, quite grotesquely fat, and very very big, sitting on a rock as the witness of its existance fades away before it. Holliday was apparently quite pleased with it, but Carroll didn't think a picture of something that has a great deal more visual impact than even a Lovecraftian monster would be apt. I can see his point.


Bandersnatches are again of uncertain lineage, although annotations to the Seventh Fit of the Snark (where one such beast assaults the Banker) indicate that it may be based on bandor or bandar, a ferocious watch-dog and the rhesus monkey, respectively. We do know that it can 'grab', 'extend its neck' and that its 'frumious jaws/Went savagely snapping around -', which indicates something as to its anatomy. 'Frumious' is, according to Carrol's foreword, what happens when the balanced mind tries to pronounce the words Fearful and Furious at the same time.

Needless to say, I've often wondered what the man was smoking.


I'm uncertain of any etymology pertaining to the Jabberwock. As we all know, it's a kind of slimy dragon monster, but that's the extent of my knowledge (other than that it's THE Jabberwock, thus indicating a unique status similar to the Tarrasque). And the other creatures (toves, borogoves and rathes) are detailed in Alice Through The Looking Glass (look for Humpty Dumpty, a rather learned fellow fond of pontificating).


Except for the Jub-Jub bird, which is again better described in the Snark (as one Fit revolves around its implied presence). It's capable of uttering frightening cries, and the Butcher informs the Beaver of certain other of its qualities: it would appear to be desperate and in perpetual passion, and ages ahead of current fashion in costume. It knows any friend it has met once before, can't be bribed, collects at charity meetings, and tastes better than mutton, oysters or eggs. Some readers' interpretations have certain stanzas of the Fifth Fit as describing a regular polyhedron.

Needless to say, I've often wondered what the readers were smoking.


Well, there's my contribution to certain obscure monstrosities... I hope it's been useful.

(As a big PS, I've written a board game based on the Snark, which is very strange and not really playable just yet. I may return to it in the future.)

Helpful indeed, S/lash. I have never been lucky enough to be able to track down a copy of the Hunting of the Snark, unfortunately.

But let us not forget the dubious, yet funny, Book of Ratings material on the subject of Jabberwocks and Bandersnatches...

"The Jabberwock
Given that so many words in the poem are "portmanteaus," which is to say made up of two smaller words, we can only assume that the Jabberwock was intended to be a combination of "jock" and "abbey," in other words a sort of athletic nun. That would explain the "claws that catch." Presumably it also has legs that run for touchdowns and a blood-stained wimple. B+"

"Bandersnatches
Jabberwocks and Jub-Jub birds, frankly, don't sound that tough. Bandersnatches, however, seem pretty menacing, especially if you're a bander. And the one in the poem is frumious, which is a combination of "furious" and "rum," meaning an angry drunk. Let the kid from the story take on an angry, boozed-up Bandersnatch! Then we'll see who's galumphing! A"

Demiurge out.

Demi... You, sir, have just been elevated to godhood in my book. Thanks a bunch for these informative posts.

-Wanderlust

Origins of Other Monsters: Monster Manual

Barghest: Derived from an English black dog, much like the hell hound etc. Barghest was a singular black dog, and was even credited with the ability to turn into a goblin as the DnD monster.

Behir: Derived from the Scottish beithir, a giant snake that was thought to embody lightning.

Bodak: The monster's not, but the name's derived from the the Scottish bodach or bodachan sabhaill, a goblin that stole naughty children.

Demons:
Babau: I'll have to check, but I believe this is a French ghoul.
Succubus: Legends of the succubus (and their male counterpart, the incubus) were a major part of Medieval demonology. They were probably based on the phenomena of sleep paralysis and what's sometimes called hagging. Note that they were also based on the same legends as the nightmare and night hag (see also).

Devils:
Erinyes: The name is an alternate name for the pursuing spirits of justice, the Furies, in Greek mythology.

Dragonne: A heraldric beast of Medieval times.

Hags:
Annis: Based on the British ogress Black Annis or Black Annie. Black Annis hung human skins from trees outside her lair and had only one eye.
Green Hag: Based on the British hag Jenny Greenteeth.

Night Hag: This monster may be derived from the phenomena of sleep paralysis as well and possibly from the Russian nocnitsa. It has a dream haunting power that is keeping with what it may have been.

Nightmare: The nightmare was based on the Norse mara, another dreamhaunting creature.

Stirge: Derived from the witches of Rome, or strigae, who were known for shapeshifting into owls and for vampirism.

Wyvern: Although also a class of dragon, the term wyvern was descended from the Welsh gwiber.

demiurge1138 said:

Also, I have heard reference to Chysaor before, but only in passing. What was it (other than a flying horse)?

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Honestly, I haven't heard much more than the name either, but it was specifically stated that Chrysaor was the horse born from Medusa's blood. Pegasus was still the fluffy white horse we all know and love. Maybe Chrysaor is even just another name for Pegasus.

mmm.... made up words.... for evil things....

More Monsters: Monster Manual II

Firbolg: The fir bholga, or "people of the bag", were the inhabitants of Ireland after the fomorians and before the Tuatha de Danaan.

Jahi: A Persian demoness, rather like the Babylonian Lilitu (Hebrew Lilith).

Linnorm: Linorms were the name of serpentine dragons in Scandinavian mythology. The belief in linorms was strong until last century.

Marrash: Not sure on the name, but this guy always looked like the demon Pazuzu to me.

More Monsters: Fiend Folio

Bacchae: The Bacchae were, properly speaking, priests of the Roman god Bacchus (Gk. Dionysus), but their powers and everything fit better with the Greek maenads, wild nymphs who served that god.

Death Dog: Orthrus was the two-headed one in Greek mythology. Cerberus had three.

Fossergrim: The fossergrim or wassermann were river spirits in Norse mythology. They were reputed to be skilled violinists, and would teach people those skills.

Kelp Angler: Might be based on the Scottish fideal, an entangling water fey.

Kelpie: Based on, surprisingly, the Scottish kelpie.

Selkie: Based on the Scottish selkie (Irish roane).

Senmurv: Based on the Persian bird commonly called simurgh, well, in name anyway. The simurgh was kind of a phoenix.

Good stuff

I have a couple of questions for the knowledgable;

Does anyone know where the ideas of trolls haivng super-fast healing came from? None of the Norse myth's I've read mention anything like this.

What about the ixitiachitlixillaitchitizzleferschnizzle? Er, that is to say, the evil vampiric stingray? From the name I assume a south american (probably Aztec) origin. Know anything more?