What Do You Feel is Necessary or Recommended?

Bromjunaar

First Post
I've been getting an itch to try 4e again (started with it shortly before 5e came out and I've been with that since), and was wondering what the community feels is needed or even just recommended for published book material to gather before it starts to get too expensive to grab on Amazon or Ebay?

So far, I'm thinking about grabbing PHBs 1+2, DMGs 1+2, and I've seen recommendations to skip MM 1+2 and jump straight to MM 3 and the Monster Vault. I'm not sure what other books would be worth grabbing (or if the ones I'm thinking about getting aren't, I didn't have the books back then and was just using the free online stuff at the time) and would appreciate hearing what you guys had to say on the subject.
 

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S

Sunseeker

Guest
The PHBs are worth it. The DMGs are kinda meh. I agree with skipping to the MM3 and Nentir Vale and monster-related stuff like that. The Draconomicons are worth it IMO because they add some creative flavors of dragons to the mix, along with a good-aligned counterpart to the Dracolich the "Hollow Dragon".
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
I think the DMG2 has a lot of Awesome sauce in it...

I also highly recommend The Heros of the Fey Wild, in spite of it being a post essentials thing.

Love all the Martial Power books.

I think you should try out the different Monster Manuals, and pay attention to how it plays with each if your players optimize really heavily versus not so much you will get different experiences too. The online player base has its own impact.


oK I admit it I like all the books, I am a book person but I use Character Builder with custom content etc via CBLoader.
 

Its hard to answer this question with 4e because it really is just filled with awesome stuff. There was never a book you would say "don't bother with this."

That being said... What do you NEED to play? You really should have DMG1-2 and PHB1-2. You can go with MM3, MV, and MV:TtNV, but there ARE some holes in that assortment of monsters. WotC never bothered to really reissue a full set of dragons for instance. While there are a number of demons and devils and other 'classic' monsters in the later books, a lot of the standbys are in MM1-2. Still, you can always get the later books first and the earlier ones later if you feel the need.

There are a LOT of other good books. The Rules Compendium is a nice thing to have, it has a lot of cleaned up core rules, the best version of the SC rules, etc. Anyway its a cheap book. Beyond that ALL the GM facing books are interesting. Some are really not needed unless you want to focus on what they cover (IE if you want to do adventures in the Astral Sea, then The Plane Above is a good book, otherwise its kinda overkill). The Open Grave was about the earliest one, that's kinda dated, but STILL has a lot of good stuff if you want to dig into undead. The Draconomicons are a little old too, the monsters in them could use a refresh, but AGAIN they are filled with great material. Underdark is cool, etc. MotP is very handy if you plan to do anything at all in the planes.

The player-side books are all quite nice. Some are even close to mandatory for some classes. Arcane Power for Wizards and Warlocks, Divine Power for STR Paladins (paladins in general really), etc. Its hard to dis any book. AV1 and AV2 MIGHT be considered obsolescent due to MME, but they STILL have a lot of stuff in them that is considered pretty vital for most builds. Post-Essentials books are even more cool in that the production quality gets better the later you go in 4e. Heroes of Shadow, Heroes of the Feywild (the best D&D supplement EVER IMHO), and Heroes of the Elemental Chaos are all pretty cool.

The only stuff I might skip is the DSG, which was the last 4e book to come out. I kinda felt like it wasn't trying that hard. It has some decent stuff in it, but nothing really crazy good. The BoVD came out around the same time, and I found that one more interesting, though again its not like you NEED it.

PHB3 is sort of an oddball. Frankly I never crack it open these days. If you want to play with Hybrids then its useful. Otherwise there's not too much in there that you NEED. The classes are forgettable, the Monk excepted, and the races are highly niche (I liked Wilden, but they certainly aren't something you NEED).
 


Hybrids are definitely the reason I would keep the PHB3 entirely

I have mixed feelings about them. They can be a handy build tool sometimes I guess, but I never really saw them do anything particularly special for the game. I feel like they were kind of added to fill out the PHB3 page count and as a sop to 3.5 lovers who hate 4e MCing.
 

Jhaelen

First Post
The Draconomicons are worth it IMO because they add some creative flavors of dragons to the mix, along with a good-aligned counterpart to the Dracolich the "Hollow Dragon".
I'd especially recommend the 2nd Draconomicon because it provides some excellent insight into making the various good-aligned dragons into great villains.

If you don't care much about dragons, my two other favorite books from the 4e era were 'The Plane Above: Secrets of the Astral Sea' and 'The Plane Below: Secrets of the Elemental Chaos'. Apart from providing great background info about the 4e cosmology they were full of material ready to be inserted into your games: story hooks, encounters, terrain features, etc.

I also liked 'Hammerfast: A Dwarven Outpost Adventure Site' a lot. It's a very detailed description of a rather weird dwarven settlement with countless npcs, story hooks and even a small campaign outline. IT had everything that all of the 4e adventure modules lacked.
 

MwaO

Adventurer
I have mixed feelings about them. They can be a handy build tool sometimes I guess, but I never really saw them do anything particularly special for the game. I feel like they were kind of added to fill out the PHB3 page count and as a sop to 3.5 lovers who hate 4e MCing.

To 3.5 lovers? 3.5 MC'ing has very little to do with 4e Hybrids, if anything. I mean, almost no one split 50/50 in classes.

4e Hybrids are the closest thing to AD&D MC'ing to me. Except (generally) balanced and fun.
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
To 3.5 lovers? 3.5 MC'ing has very little to do with 4e Hybrids, if anything. I mean, almost no one split 50/50 in classes.

4e Hybrids are the closest thing to AD&D MC'ing to me. Except (generally) balanced and fun.

Agreed, I think Hybrids finished opening the flexibility for character design that last step.(without encouraging that dabble of this and dabble of that and just a touch of this uber optimizing)
 
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Tony Vargas

Legend
So far, I'm thinking about grabbing PHBs 1+2, DMGs 1+2, and I've seen recommendations to skip MM 1+2 and jump straight to MM 3 and the Monster Vault. I'm not sure what other books would be worth grabbing.
Heroes of the Feywild is about the best thing to come out of the post-esentials period. The '_________ Power' books really help out certain classes, adding a lot of options to martial characters and shoring up some of the shakier options in the PH1.

The Rules Compendium is terribly handy, it duplicated the core rules in the PH & DMGs, but with more errata built in (some of it, like Skill Challenges, great, others, like item dailies & rarity, nots'much).

Even if you might feel the need to tweak the monsters to MMIII standards, Open Grave, the Draconomicons, and Plane Above/Below are nice resources, full of ideas.
 
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