D&D 4E Deva Warlord - Aurelia Warleader

cbwjm said:

This just gave me an idea for creating a map for a world (normally I just scribble some basic shapes and build something from that). Take 30 or so basic land cards shuffle them together and then deal them out into a grid like 4x4 or 3x5 and then convert the mix of islands, forests, mountains, etc into a map. Islands could represent any large body of water if falling in the centre of a land mass.

On a side note, Aurelia is CR 23 in 5e. Her stats are in the ravnica guide.

Click to expand...

I pegged her at CR 18.

In magic terms casting cost 6 is generally at the upper limit of what is playable and things like Dragonlords tend to start at CC 6. Casting cost 10-15 is generally the upper limit of MtG critters and would be CR 20+ IMHO as they are basically epic level foes (epic being 15+ in 5E, 20+ 3/4E).

I would say CC6 is "beyond what is feasible in a normal game of magic." For example Force of Nature is a CC6 card which is pretty widely thought of as beyond the practical limit of castability in an actual game of magic, though it can be fun to trot out in non-serious play. I would consider it to be something akin to the 'Terrasque' of M:tG, a monster of the maximum possible brute power, and thus in 4e terms 'level 30+'. Obviously there are stronger things, demon lords and gods and such, which maybe roughly correspond to things like the Dragonlords perhaps.

Now, perhaps the practical limits of mana have changed in Magic in the past 20 years, but I doubt they've changed THAT much. Aside some 'convert life to mana' types of things (Howls, Hurricane, etc.) its HARD to muster 10 mana in a turn with a practical deck, and few strategies will let you survive long enough to develop to that reliably.

It can actually be quite easy to generate a lot of mana, especially if playing green with their mana generating elves. There are also artefacts like power stones that generate 1 mana for each power stone you control and the guild lockets that generate mana. One set of magic had cards that generated treasures that gave a single use of 1 point of mana.

AbdulAlhazred said:

I would say CC6 is "beyond what is feasible in a normal game of magic." For example Force of Nature is a CC6 card which is pretty widely thought of as beyond the practical limit of castability in an actual game of magic, though it can be fun to trot out in non-serious play. I would consider it to be something akin to the 'Terrasque' of M:tG, a monster of the maximum possible brute power, and thus in 4e terms 'level 30+'. Obviously there are stronger things, demon lords and gods and such, which maybe roughly correspond to things like the Dragonlords perhaps.

Now, perhaps the practical limits of mana have changed in Magic in the past 20 years, but I doubt they've changed THAT much. Aside some 'convert life to mana' types of things (Howls, Hurricane, etc.) its HARD to muster 10 mana in a turn with a practical deck, and few strategies will let you survive long enough to develop to that reliably.

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They changed MtG around 10 years ago. cc6 did start seeing play in things like ramp decks and various dragons. They also made these titans at cc6.

Some decks like Eldrazi ramp were also hard casting CC 10. Force of Nature has been powercrept out.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=primeval+titan

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=inferno+titan

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=frost+titan

They were back in 2008 or 9 IIRC.

And the Dragon highlords circa 2001 or 2002. This was one of the weak ones.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=124073

Come to think of it a CC 6 Dragon is probably a old Dragon so CR 23 for the angle might be about right.

They powered up critters in 2000 or so and again in 2005 or so. 3/3 critters for 2 mana no drawbacks, 2/2 criters with haste for R 4/4 gain 4 life for WG2.

Zardnaar said:

They changed MtG around 10 years ago. cc6 did start seeing play in things like ramp decks and various dragons. They also made these titans at cc6.

Some decks like Eldrazi ramp were also hard casting CC 10. Force of Nature has been powercrept out.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=primeval+titan

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=inferno+titan

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=frost+titan

They were back in 2008 or 9 IIRC.

And the Dragon highlords circa 2001 or 2002. This was one of the weak ones.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=124073

Come to think of it a CC 6 Dragon is probably a old Dragon so CR 23 for the angle might be about right.

They powered up critters in 2000 or so and again in 2005 or so. 3/3 critters for 2 mana no drawbacks, 2/2 criters with haste for R 4/4 gain 4 life for WG2.

Click to expand...

It does allow them to be more interesting some of the old decks had to be blandish in the name of efficiency I think I am going to go with this adjustment being a good thing.

And yes I ended up designing a PC version of the angel which felt full blown at 23 or 26

In the "how low can you go" category is I did design an interesting character with fragile wings that can be used in a burst periodically or more in long distance travel awoken by ritual and might be ok for someone shooting for a character which feels like her at much lower levels.

Not sure this is exactly a perfect representation I wasn't even too picky about many accessories but... since character builder was mentioned.

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Aurelia Warleader, level 30
Deva, Warlord, Favored Soul, Exalted Angel
Build: Tactical Warlord
Archer Warlord Optional Choice: Standard Warlord Armor Features
Warlord: Combat Leader
Commanding Presence: Tactical Presence
Warlord Style: Inspiring
Background: Auspicious Birth (Auspicious Birth Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 24, Con 12, Dex 12, Int 26, Wis 16, Cha 12.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 10, Dex 10, Int 16, Wis 12, Cha 10.


AC: 45 Fort: 39 Reflex: 40 Will: 39
HP: 198 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 49

TRAINED SKILLS
Athletics +26, Diplomacy +23, Intimidate +21, History +32, Endurance +22, Arcana +28, Religion +30

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +15, Bluff +16, Dungeoneering +33, Heal +18, Insight +22, Nature +18, Perception +20, Stealth +15, Streetwise +16, Thievery +17, Engineering +23

FEATS
Learned Spellcaster: Ritual Caster
Warlord: Martial Artistry
Level 1: Learned Spellcaster
Level 2: Arcane Familiar
Level 4: War Ready
Level 6: Disciple of Divine Wrath
Level 8: Shielding Familiar
Level 10: Inspirational Attacker
Level 11: Combat Commander
Level 12: Warlord's Formation
Level 14: Toughness
Level 16: Mark of Making
Level 18: Remembered Mother Tongue
Level 20: Eager Advance
Level 21: Audacious Crow
Level 22: Arbiter of Justice
Level 24: Expert Combat Leader
Level 26: Rose King's Shield
Level 28: Epic Will
Level 30: Shared Resources

POWERS
Warlord at-will 1: Inevitable Wave
Warlord at-will 1: Brash Assault
Warlord encounter 1: Diabolic Stratagem
Warlord daily 1: Orchestrated Offensive
Warlord daily 1 Spellbook: Lead the Attack
Warlord utility 2: Strategist's Epiphany
Warlord utility 2 Spellbook: Aid the Injured
Warlord encounter 3: Interrupting Strike
Warlord daily 5: Staggering Spin
Warlord daily 5 Spellbook: Villain's Nightmare
Warlord utility 6: Polearm Vault
Warlord utility 6 Spellbook: Guide the Charge
Warlord encounter 7: Surprise Attack
Warlord daily 9: Iron Dragon Charge
Warlord daily 9 Spellbook: Teachable Moment
Warlord utility 10: Tactical Shift
Warlord utility 10 Spellbook: Strength of Conviction
Warlord encounter 13: Pincer Maneuver (replaces Diabolic Stratagem)
Warlord daily 15: War Master's Assault (replaces Orchestrated Offensive)
Warlord daily 15 Spellbook: Grim Instruction
Warlord utility 16: Forbidden Ground
Warlord utility 16 Spellbook: Strength Against Strength
Warlord encounter 17: Pincer Shot (replaces Pincer Maneuver)
Warlord daily 19: End to Games (replaces War Master's Assault)
Warlord daily 19 Spellbook: Glasya's Stride
Warlord utility 22: Rush of Battle
Warlord utility 22 Spellbook: Avenge Me
Warlord encounter 23: Daring Display (replaces Interrupting Strike)
Warlord daily 25: Forceful Leader (replaces Staggering Spin)
Warlord daily 25 Spellbook: Herding Barrage
Warlord encounter 27: Warlord's Indignation (replaces Pincer Shot)
Warlord daily 29: Deific Rallying (replaces End to Games)
Warlord daily 29 Spellbook: Flawless Snare

ITEMS
Strategy Book, Inspired Recuperation, Breaching Ram, Battle Spirit Longsword +6, Adventurer's Kit, Cloak of the Phoenix +6, Belt of Sonnlinor Righteousness (epic tier), Ranging Defender Shield Light Shield (epic tier), Marshal Troops / Oath of Fealty, Oath of Truth, Blood Demand / Blood Oath, Technique: Perfect Disarm, Perfected Disarm, Sunleaf Elderhide Armor +6
RITUALS
Phantom Steed, Familiar Mount
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======

Not real impressed with the 5e version though i suppose written as a monster its ok.

Anyway I like the character a lot. I built her as a PC so how about some elaborations

Player Character Story: she is a foundling with markings that appeared like birthmarks of angel wings this was enough for everyone around her to declare she was something beyond extraordinary with an extraordinary (her adopted parents groomed her to inherit the mantle of leadership as her father is known for strategic genius and mother tactical - nobody seems to notice she is adopted). As she got older the markings only became clearer til now most who may see them assume they are tattoos ( mechanically speaking they are her familiar ) She generally does not hide them, and often has customized gear to ensure they arent hidden. (the more magical gear she picks up later seems to adapt to her will and the wings even though like a tattoo in dormant state appear etched in the armors surface ) Her people were not religious and she assumed the markings must be magical which inspired a budding fascination for the arcane but that came after following in her parents footsteps.



The above give her bursts of flying at quite low level she is picking it up at level 2


She finds eventually level 4 the arcane leads her to not only sense magic flowing around them and other things but she could use incense while meditating to stabilize them for overland flight (and may be able to spend raw karma points on it in emergencies.) There is a feat that can represent her using her wings to block attacks against her (Shielding Familiar).

Character builder thinks this is a regulation character (subject to my changes enabling the martial practices by default for the Warlord and custom martial practices and the like) but ummm I am not sure why the character builder let me take the Disciple of Divinity Multi-class when I already took Learned Caster.... there might be erie music in the background because I cannot duplicate the stunt.

Well this is certainly light armor