Poll : Do you allow godless clerics? - Page 2




View Poll Results: Do you like/allow clerics without a diety?

Voters
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  • I don't like godless clerics for mechanical reasons.

    14 4.93%
  • I don't like godless clerics for flavor/homebrew gameworld reasons.

    117 41.20%
  • I don't like godless clerics for other reasons I will outline below.

    5 1.76%
  • I'm OK with godless clerics.

    86 30.28%
  • I love godless clerics!

    51 17.96%
  • I never knew you could have a cleric without a patron god until reading this thread...

    11 3.87%
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  1. #11
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    ° Ignore Saeviomagy
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Jezter
    I'm running a Forgotten Realms campaign, and it's stated quite clearly in the FRCS that godless clerics aren't allowed. In fact, ANY divine spellcaster (even rangers and paladins) must have a patron deity to cast spells.

    I don't care for the concept of godless clerics; it dosen't make sense to me that a cleric would be able to cast divine spells without a god granting them.
    Just think of them in the same way as wizards - wizards don't have to get their spells 'granted'. The power comes from their use of formulae and their own will.

    In the same way a godless cleric's power comes from rituals and his devotion to an ideal.

 

  • #12
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    ° Ignore Teflon Billy
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Chance
    How many boos does a godless cleric keep?
    usually 1/ class level


    "...show me a game where the roleplaying involves deep emotional experiences and making tough decisions in-character and experiencing vicarious unpleasantness and, generally, all the stuff that people like Ron Edwards insist is the very heart of roleplaying without which the activity has no meaning and is so much wasted time, and I'll show you me leaving the room..."

    ---Stephenls; RPG.net Moderator---

  • #13
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    ° Ignore Gellion
    I love godless Clerics. And anybody who does not agree with me should be drug out into the street and beaten with toxic kittens.J/K.
    "Darkness beyond blackest pitch, deeper than the deepest night! Lord of Darkness, shining like gold upon the Sea of Chaos, I call upon thee, swear myself to thee! Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess! GIGA SLAVE!!"

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  • #14
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    ° Ignore Teflon Billy
    Quote Originally Posted by Steverooo
    ...If a Druid or Ranger can draw "divine" power from unintelligent nature, I don't see why a Cleric can't draw the same from an unintelligent ideal...
    That's actually a petty good point from a Canonical D&D standpoint.

    Doesn't change my "homebrew reasons" answer...but your point is well taken.


    "...show me a game where the roleplaying involves deep emotional experiences and making tough decisions in-character and experiencing vicarious unpleasantness and, generally, all the stuff that people like Ron Edwards insist is the very heart of roleplaying without which the activity has no meaning and is so much wasted time, and I'll show you me leaving the room..."

    ---Stephenls; RPG.net Moderator---

  • #15
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    ° Ignore Umbran
    I've never had to use the option, and I'd prefer if they were directly worked into the world metaphysics than allowed simply because the rulebook says thay should be. But I think it's pretty analogous to druids and rangers, as others have noted. One can draw power from faith in an ideal, or from a force of the universe, and not have that ideal or force be a sentient being in a polytheistic pantheon.

  • #16
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    ° Ignore Wormwood
    I'll allow a godless cleric if the players in question occasionally requested domains such as 'Good', 'Healing' or 'Law'...

    Unfortunately, all godless clerics *I've* seen proposed tend to skew heavily toward 'Elf', 'Time', and 'Celerity'

    Odd that.

  • #17
    I run a variant Book of the Righteous cosmology. This book is an awesome resource for religion in D20, but I digress .

    The Great Church, in that Cosmology, worships all the good-aligned gods. Thus, any "godless" Cleric in my campaign would probably worship all the gods, and probably be associated with the Great Church.

    So, they wouldn't be godless ... but would they be churchless? That might be a more interesting question.

  • #18
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    ° Ignore Kahuna Burger
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsyr
    The only "godless" clerics in my game are ones that nobody know what god they worship, but they do in fact worship a god.

    Godless cleric's dont exist, and I would never allow one.
    Uh, I hope you meant the "in my game" bit to apply to your second paragraph as well... otheriwse that was a very very weird comment...

    Kahuna burger
    I understand, comprehend, get, grok, and see your point. I can take, handle, cope and deal with the way you run your game. The reasons I disagree with you and/or dislike your playstyle preference lie elsewhereů

  • #19
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    ° Ignore Kahuna Burger
    Quote Originally Posted by Wormwood
    I'll allow a godless cleric if the players in question occasionally requested domains such as 'Good', 'Healing' or 'Law'...

    Unfortunately, all godless clerics *I've* seen proposed tend to skew heavily toward 'Elf', 'Time', and 'Celerity'

    Odd that.
    I'm sorry about your players. my godless (in fact atheistic) cleric has the knowlege and protection domains... I don't know a lot of the 2nd party domains, but I doubt there were any that fit my character concept better...

    Kahuna Burger
    I understand, comprehend, get, grok, and see your point. I can take, handle, cope and deal with the way you run your game. The reasons I disagree with you and/or dislike your playstyle preference lie elsewhereů

  • #20
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    ° Ignore shadow
    I like the idea of "godless" clerics from a game standpoint. It allows the DM to customize a campaign. Believe it or not, not every DM runs a campaign that assumes a polytheistic pantheon made up of token deities. I've seen campaigns that run the gamut from animistic (every natural thing has a spirit) to complete lack of gods (such as Dark Sun where "clerics" draw power from the elements.)

    Although my campaign is not "godless" I assume that clerics serve some vague quasi-Catholic good church or some evil religion, and never go into many details about religion. I've gamed with people who were uncomfortable about "worshiping" false gods (although "casting spells" was okay). I've also gamed with some creepy people who got so into their cleric class that they were actually wanting to act out the rituals that their cleric was doing. Hence, the "godless" cleric option allows me to take religion out of the game when it causes people to get uncomfortable.
    When you are in the midst of night look toward the stars.

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