Two Weapon Fighting and Multiple Attacks from BAB

Dax Doomslayer · Dec 3, 2003

Hi Folks,
Easy question (I think) that I'm trying to get confirmation on. With a fighter with multiple attacks due to their BAB uses two weapons, is that additional attack at the highest attack modifier? For example (without using any strength/magic etc modifiers), there is a 6th level fighter with a BAB of +6/+1 who has the Two-Weapon Fighting feat and is using a light weapon in his off-hand (-2/-2). The two weapons add one attack. Thus would it be +4/-1/+4? Or would it be +4/-1/-1? I'm pretty sure it is at the higher BAB but can not find it anywhere in the PHB. Any help would be appreciated!! Thanks.

Jeff Wilder · Dec 3, 2003

Dax Doomslayer said:
With a fighter with multiple attacks due to their BAB uses two weapons, is that additional attack at the highest attack modifier?

Yes. (In your example, the 6th level fighter would attack at +4/-1 with the primary weapon and +4 with the secondary weapon.) Checking the 3.5E SRD, I am surprised this isn't made explicit in the Two-Weapon Fighting feat; I assume they felt it was clear enough in the absense of iterative attacks that there was no need.

Jeff

Voadam · Dec 3, 2003

It is explicitly spelled out in the combat section of the 3.5 srd under two weapon fighting

TWO-WEAPON FIGHTING
If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. You suffer a –6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a –10 penalty to the attack with your off hand when you fight this way. You can reduce these penalties in two ways:
•If your off-hand weapon is light, the penalties are reduced by 2 each. (An unarmed strike is always considered light.)
•The Two-Weapon Fighting feat lessens the primary hand penalty by 2, and the off-hand penalty by 6.
Table: Two-Weapon Fighting Penalties summarizes the interaction of all these factors.

Table: Two-Weapon Fighting Penalties
Circumstances Primary Hand Off Hand
Normal penalties –6 –10
Off-hand weapon is light –4 –8
Two-Weapon Fighting feat –4 –4
Off-hand weapon is light and Two-Weapon Fighting feat –2 –2

mikebr99 · Dec 3, 2003

And this is why the 2 weapon feat chain exists.... to increase the number of attacks with your off-hand weapon.

Mike

Dax Doomslayer · Dec 4, 2003

Voadam said:
It is explicitly spelled out in the combat section of the 3.5 srd under two weapon fighting

TWO-WEAPON FIGHTING
If you wield a second weapon in your off hand, you can get one extra attack per round with that weapon. You suffer a –6 penalty with your regular attack or attacks with your primary hand and a –10 penalty to the attack with your off hand when you fight this way. You can reduce these penalties in two ways:
•If your off-hand weapon is light, the penalties are reduced by 2 each. (An unarmed strike is always considered light.)
•The Two-Weapon Fighting feat lessens the primary hand penalty by 2, and the off-hand penalty by 6.
Table: Two-Weapon Fighting Penalties summarizes the interaction of all these factors.

Table: Two-Weapon Fighting Penalties
Circumstances Primary Hand Off Hand
Normal penalties –6 –10
Off-hand weapon is light –4 –8
Two-Weapon Fighting feat –4 –4
Off-hand weapon is light and Two-Weapon Fighting feat –2 –2

Hi Folks,
Thanks for the reply. I believe something has gotten "muddied" here (although wilder_jw did answer my question). Actually, the question isn't what the modifiers are for two weapon fighting but instead if one gets multiple attacks due to their BAB (i.e. 6th level for a fighter) AND is using 2 weapons, what BAB is that third attack? Is it at the highest BAB or the lowest? Thus a 6th level fighter is +6 / +1. If they have two weapons (assuming they have all the proper 2 weapon fighting feats and thus -2 / -2) would the BAB be +4 / -1 with the extra attack being at +4? Or will the extra attack be at -1 (the lower BAB)? That is actually my question. If I misinterpreted your point, please let me know! Thanks!!

Hypersmurf · Dec 4, 2003

All the attacks from Two-Weapon Fighting and from the TWF feat chain are based on your highest BAB.

The first attack for using a second weapon uses your highest BAB, plus all appropriate modifiers, and TWF penalties.

The second attack - from Improved Two Weapon Fighting - uses your highest BAB, plus all appropriate modifiers, and TWF penalties... and also incurs a -5 penalty.

The third attack - from Greater Two Weapon Fighting - uses your highest BAB, plus all appropriate modifiers, and TWF penalties... and also incurs a -10 penalty.

-Hyp.

Dax Doomslayer · Dec 4, 2003

Hypersmurf said:
All the attacks from Two-Weapon Fighting and from the TWF feat chain are based on your highest BAB.

The first attack for using a second weapon uses your highest BAB, plus all appropriate modifiers, and TWF penalties.

The second attack - from Improved Two Weapon Fighting - uses your highest BAB, plus all appropriate modifiers, and TWF penalties... and also incurs a -5 penalty.

The third attack - from Greater Two Weapon Fighting - uses your highest BAB, plus all appropriate modifiers, and TWF penalties... and also incurs a -10 penalty.

-Hyp.

Thanks Hypersmurf!! That is what I thought. The issue is, I could not find it in the PHB or SRD anywhere. I found that odd . . . Thanks again.

Ranger REG · Dec 4, 2003

That's because it was discussed many times during 3e. Check the 3e FAQ.

Darklone · Dec 4, 2003

Btw, does anyone have a clue why there's not a fourth feat for a fourth attack when the BAB reaches 16? I can't imagine balance issues...

brendan candries · Dec 4, 2003

Is there any ruling about the timing of those attacks?

I'm sure that for each specific hand you go from lowest to highest penalty.

Are you allowed to swap between hands as you see fit?

Are you allowed to start with your off-hand? Or does your first attack decide what your primary/off-hand is?

etc ...