King Arthur d20 - Not Necessarily Pendragon d20

Pendragon is a fantastic game, one of the most beautiful RPGs ever written. Chaosium's house system isn't my cup of tea, but Pendragon's roleplaying mechanics really do show that game stats can aid roleplaying.

That said and out of the way, I'm a big fan of King Arthur in general. I've been kicking around the idea of doing the entire milieu for d20. Without making it a Pendragon d20 conversion, how could I go about doing it? What ways could the D&D/d20 system be used to help evoke the "feel" of such a setting?

Thoughts/ideas/observations?

The use of original source material strikes me as the most pressing need. The original mediaeval corpus of Morte D'Arthur (Malory), Tristan (Gottfried von Strasbourg (?)), Tristram (Thomas), Le Morte de Roi Artu (Anonymous), Parsifal, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight etc. should form the foundation - if you're looking for the high romantic feel. Other contemporary literature like the Niebelungenlied and the Song of Roland, although detailing different eras and figures, also runs in the same vein. Taliesin and the Mabinogion give a good Celtic twist, if that's your desire.

Have you thought about converting the Arthurian Heroes from 1e Deities and Demigods? I don't have the book handy, but the idea of the "Knight of Renown" and "Knight of Quality" were always good.

It's a big task, but I think it promises great rewards. There really is a magic about the whole Arthur thing.

Good suggestions. Yes, I'm going to do a conversion of the 1e Deities & Demigods stuff, or at least some of it - the Knights you mention, for example. They make for good "generic" NPCs (you know, so one could say simply: "The Brown Knight: Use 7th level Knight of Quality stats, with these modifications." Helps making NPCs on the fly go more smoothly.

All the source material you mention, and stuff like Geoffrey of Monmouth's "History," are great resources. Steinbeck's treatment of the legends is also very good, especially his telling of Lancelot's tale.

Another thing I've been thinking about is making the setting flexible in regards to time period. That is, I've been thinking of ways that Arthurian Britain could have survived beyond Arthur's lifetime. This would necessitate an "alternate universe" where events like the May Babies atrocity and Guinevere's infertility would not have occurred. In a way, this has been inspired by Aragorn from Lord of the Rings - I think of him as the "anti-Arthur" in some ways, since he did everything right. For example, Aragorn refused the Ring, which finally righted the mistake make by Isildur when he took the Ring and wore it, instead of destroying it immediately. Along these lines, I was thinking of having Arthur either choose to do the right thing when he needed to - like thinking of his kingdom first and facing Mordred with reinforcements. Or, what if Lancelot had been able to resist acting upon his love for Guinevere (or vice-versa)? Things would have ended up far differently, most likely for the better.

Yeah, sometimes I feel sorry for Arthur...poor sod, he tried to do everything right and ended up doing it all wrong, really suffering for mistakes not of his own doing.

Anyway, realistically, there was no way that Arthurian Britain could have survived past Arthur's death. His Queen Guinivere (or Gwenhwyfar, as in the original versions) was infertile, so no heir apparent. Galahad, his named heir, disappeared while questing for the Grail. And finally, Arthur and Mordred, who was the only other person with a blood tie to Arthur even if he was a bastard son born of a union between Arthur and his own half-sister, killed each other. With no possible heir, all the petty kings - Lot, Rheged, Leodegrantz, Mark, would have fought for teh kingship anyway, tearing Britain apart.

Speaking of which, did you know there really was an "Arthur?" He was British chieftain who led the armies of Britain in battle at the Battle of Mons Badonicus (Badon Hill), a battle which really happened. His real name was Aurelius Ambrosius Arturius. He died at the Battle of Camlann and was buried in Glastonbury Isle.

Yep, I've read quite a bit about the legendary and historical Arthurs.

The point I was getting at about whether Arthurian Bitain could survive Arthur himself was that there are incidents that, had they gone another way, would have resulted in the kingdom remaining strong. What if Guinevere hadn't been infertile? What if she had died during her kidnapping and Arthur took a wife that could bear an heir? What if Arthur hadn't married Guinevere at all? There are many possible points of divergence. I'm reminded of a book I read a while back which was set in a Roman Empire that had never fallen - the point of divergence had been the night before Christ was crucified - and Pontius Pilate's wife convinced him to spare Jesus. A simple conversation between a husband and wife provided that pivotal moment on which the entire premise hinged. Things like that always fascinate me.

Col,

ME, Top Secret, & The Pendragon?

If you were only a WoT nut, I might believe you to be my long lost twin.



Suggestions: Alot of the same things that make ME work (IMO) could be applied to the age of Author.

1) Rare, but powerful magic.

2) I liked Lawheads modern revision that included the survivors of lost Atlantis as the lineage of Merlin, Morgan, and others. That could add to the feel of a fairy Brittian.

3) Have you read 7th Sea? Hated the system, but the spin they gave a fantasy earth was astounding. The section called Avalon is extremely niffty. The queen is 1/2 Elizebeth & 1/2 Author, very well done. Their protrayal of religion, is also worthy of note. I am a little touchy about divinity in games, so that is high praise from me. (Also loved ME divinity, nicely handled monothiestic religion).

4) Do away with D&D conventions. Few if any dungeon crawls, little armor, majority of the opponents are humans. Any monster would be of the legendary type. Treasure and Magic Items are gone except for some rare artifacts (religious, or from lost races). Restructure what you think an adventure is. SOme of the recent historical adventures in Dungeon can help with this.

5) Classes would need revamping (use WoT classes).

6) Do away with alingment (or just use generic descriptors like, devoted to XXXXX, selfish, and evil).

My homebrew game is actually a play off of 9th-11th century brittish isles. Lots of research and respinning legends. I normally run it in a free web system called age of heroes, but have worked on converting.

I'm sure Tolkien had both Atlantis and Arthur both in mind when he wrote of the Numenoreans. Think about it:

* Numenor and Atlantis were both islands raised up from the sea for semi-divine heroes to populate.

* Both were struck down for hubris.

* Arthur is the once and future king; Aragorn was the king who returned - perhaps this was a way for Tolkien to give Arthur another chance? Consider: Aragorn came to right the wrongs committed by his ancestor - specifically Isildur's foolish decision to keep the One Ring instead of immediately destroying it. Arthur, if he returned, would have the chance to right the wrongs of a long-gone king also - but in this case, it would be hmself.

* I've heard the Arthur/Atlantis thing before, which seems to make a connection between Atlantis/Numenor/Arthur/Aragorn even more likely. Well, so it seems to me. All the similarities are striking.

No, I haven't given 7th Sea more than a brief look. It never caught my interest, but I'll give it another look when I get the chance.

Instead of detailing a parallel Arthurian timeline, have you thought about setting the campaign in the period of Arthur's return? By this, I mean hundreds or perhaps thousands of years after the romantic Arthur is supposed to have flourished. As the "Once and Future King" who slumbers underneath a hill (Glastonbury Tor?), he will reconvene his court at some undisclosed future date when Britain has need of a hero again. This offers you maximum flexibility wrt. HOW you deal with the whole Arthurian thing, whilst remaining true to both the historical literature and the all of the nuances of the myth. This would truly be a "Golden Age" of chivalry.

BTW, the Numenor = Atlantis parallel is established fact. Tolkien was requested to write a myth about Atlantis (in the '20s, I think), although it was never published as a stand-alone, but incorporated into the Middle-Earth cycle. The corollary was intentional.

"Atalante" (Q.) = Akallabeth = The Downfallen.

I grew up in the West Country of England, so I'm a bit of an Arthur nut.

I'm glad I made a good guess with the Tolkien/Atlantis bit!

A "Future King" campaign would be intriguing. I hadn't thought about that. Would it be a far future where civilization had collapsed, and technology was lost, or a future with all the bells & whistles of high tech present?

Here are some "generic" knights I whipped up with PCGen. They aren't exactly a conversion of those from the 1e Deities & Demigods, but they're fairly close. These would be the guys that fill out the ranks at tourneys. I didn't give them any magical equipment, because I kind of look at these as more of a "base" to work with. I'd use them "as is" for characters like household knights or poor intinerant knights.


Average Knight of Renown, 8th level M Human Fighter8 CR 8; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (8d10)+16; hp 74; Init +1 (+1 Dex, +0 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 17 (flatfooted 17, touch 10), Lance (Heavy) +12/+7 0'/P (1d8+5 20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +11/+6 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +8, Ref +3, Will +1; Str 17, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 8, Cha 12

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +5, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +5, Listen +0, Ride +12, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack,Ride-By Attack,Shield Proficiency,Simple Weapon Proficiency,Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Half-Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)

Average Knight of Renown, 9th level M Human Fighter9 CR 9; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (9d10)+18; hp 82; Init +1 (+1 Dex, +0 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 17 (flatfooted 17, touch 10), Lance (Heavy) +13/+8 0'/P (1d8+5 20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +12/+7 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +8, Ref +4, Will +2; Str 17, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 8, Cha 12

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +7, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +5, Listen +0, Ride +15, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack, Ride-By Attack, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Half-Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)

Average Knight of Renown, 10th level M Human Fighter10 CR 10; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (10d10)+20; hp 94; Init +5 (+1 Dex, +4 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 17 (flatfooted 17, touch 10), Lance (Heavy) +14/+9 0'/P (1d8+5 20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +13/+8 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +9, Ref +4, Will +2; Str 17, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 8, Cha 12

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +9, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +5, Listen +0, Ride +16, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Initiative, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack, Ride-By Attack, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Half-Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)

Knight of Quality, 10th level M Human Fighter10 CR 10; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (10d10)+20; hp 94; Init +6 (+2 Dex, +4 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 19 (flatfooted 18, touch 11), Lance (Heavy) +14/+9 0'/P (1d8+5 20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +13/+8 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +9, Ref +5, Will +2; Str 16, Dex 14, Con 15, Int 11, Wis 9, Cha 13

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +9, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +5, Listen +0, Ride +17, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Initiative, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack, Ride-By Attack, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Full Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)

Knight of Quality, 11th level M Human Fighter11 CR 11; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (11d10)+22; hp 106; Init +6 (+2 Dex, +4 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 19 (flatfooted 18, touch 11), Lance (Heavy) +15/+10/+5 0'/P (1d8+5 20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +14/+9/+4 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +9, Ref +5, Will +2; Str 16, Dex 14, Con 15, Int 11, Wis 9, Cha 13

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +9, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +6, Listen +0, Ride +18, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Initiative, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack, Ride-By Attack, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Full Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)

Knight of Quality, 12th level M Human Fighter12 CR 12; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (12d10)+24; hp 116; Init +6 (+2 Dex, +4 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 19 (flatfooted 18, touch 11), Lance (Heavy) +16/+11/+6 0'/P (1d8+5 19-20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +15/+10/+5 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +12, Ref +6, Will +3; Str 17, Dex 14, Con 15, Int 11, Wis 9, Cha 13

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +11, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +6, Listen +0, Ride +19, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Great Fortitude, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Critical (Lance (Heavy)), Improved Initiative, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack, Ride-By Attack, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Full Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)

Knight of Quality, 13th level M Human Fighter13 CR 13; Size:M Type Humanoid; HD (13d10)+26; hp 125; Init +6 (+2 Dex, +4 Misc); Spd Walk 20'; AC 19 (flatfooted 18, touch 11), Lance (Heavy) +17/+12/+7 0'/P (1d8+5 19-20/x3 Neither M ) or Sword (Long) +16/+11/+6 0'/S (1d8+3 19-20/x2 Neither M ); Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +12, Ref +6, Will +3; Str 17, Dex 14, Con 15, Int 11, Wis 9, Cha 13

Skills and Feats: Handle Animal +11, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) +7, Listen +0, Ride +20, Spot +0; Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Cleave, Great Cleave, Great Fortitude, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Critical (Lance (Heavy)), Improved Initiative, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Power Attack, Ride-By Attack, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Spirited Charge, Trample, Weapon Focus (Lance (Heavy)), Weapon Specialization (Lance (Heavy))
Possessions: Full Plate, Horse (Heavy War), Lance (Heavy), Sword (Long)